The “like there was ever any doubt pt.II” edition.
Banks – Jay should use the “bling defense” and have Marcus flash his watch as teams bring the ball up the court. That thing could defend Kobe without fouling him.
Bargnani – another poor shooting night, but you have to wonder if it’s because he is concentrating on his defensive effort. Maybe the guy truly is one dimensional. In any event, we didn’t need your stinkin’ points today anyway, you big lug of goo.
Belinelli – see what a shave and a spray tan can do? It was like the loss of the whiskers was enough for the ball to be guided through the hoop. He re-found his shooting stroke, had a beautiful no-look bounce pass in traffic and he played with that spirit he showed earlier in the season during his strong games.
Bosh – the powderkeg to start the game once again. 6pts and 3rebs in the first 4 minutes and he ended the game with 25/12 in just 22min. 7 of those boards came on the offensive end, by the way. Those of you that questioned his effort this week should be ashamed. Yes, I’m looking at you. Also, not a fan of +/-, but +36??? In 22 min???
Calderon – left the game early with a hip injury which seems minor. Got banged around a bit tonight and caught Rose on a night where he almost seemed disinterested. Good things happened when Jose drove and you could tell he was looking for DeRozan a bit more than usual, which is a good thing.
DeRozan – seemed to have a chip on his shoulder when he came out, huh Jay? The rook jammed home another alley oop and had a great slam in the first half. His eyes were lighting up again and he appears to know he can start to feel like he belongs. Nice to see. What wasn’t nice to see was that dancing in the 4th, especially given the LeBron situation last night. Stay classy.
Evans – is becoming a master at Call Of Duty.
Jack – extended minutes with Jose out, and he did his job. 6/9/4 in 32 minutes with 3 turnovers. Play of the game when he stood and tied his shoe as the game was going on. He had the ball tucked under his arm and acted like he had all the time in the world.
Johnson – well, we didn’t really need any defense tonight, so he didn’t play much. Still, 3 fouls in 13 minutes. This is still a major concern for games where we need stops. The way he played last night in OT, he needs to bring that more consistently.
Mensah-Bonsu – it was safe to put him in tonight. All you Pops fans, go see him now because in 15 days he could be outta here.
Nesterovic – workmanlike and luggish. It’s like he was created to battle Brad Miller to the death. Have to give him credit for running the floor in a blowout and during a back to back. Show them young punks how you do, big fella.
O’Bryant – tell me he doesn’t just have one suit. Please.
Turkoglu- not going to lie, I was worried when I saw him pick up his second foul only 3:30 into the game. Of course, hindsight we didn’t need him, but he still had a nifty line for his minutes: 9/5/4 in 20min. Major props for stepping up to DeMar out of that fourth quarter timeout and telling him to stop dancing and sit down. That one move made up for at least 2 of his early crappy games.
Weems – he was let lose on the world tonight and he went 0 for 3. Marcus could be seen licking his chops and dreaming about getting fitted for a jersey soon.
Wright – I could almost audibly hear RapsFan groan a few times, but Antoine played okay and under control. Still a step behind of where we need him, in my opinion, but that could still come. Guess we just need more blowouts to see.
Driving The Bus: Chris Bosh
Under The Bus: Andrea Bargnani
Game Theme:
169 Raps
First game after a long time, Triano coached great! See we are rolling leave the starters in, finish it fast. He left them in, and the game was kind of over in the first quarter. Players got hot and Triano did not take them this time. Good coaching! Only thing: Why did DD not come back in the fourth? He is just rolling, and don’t coaches usually leave rookies in game in blow out minutes?
Overall, very nice game to watch (for us). Bosh played like a franchise player… Watching DD just makes me feel good nowadays! If makes me wonder, how good of a team we would be if the Raptors play like this every night!
Lol, Rasho was born to do that with Miller.. Ohh man, you had me rolling on the floor.
Haha, me too! You are hilarious dude! Love these Roll Calls!
Keep it up!
Evans – Getting better at COD. Haha!
Agreed, best Roll Call of the Season thus far. “It’s like he was created to battle Brad Miller to the death.” = so hilarious.
not surprisingly everyone is in good mood. “best roll call ever dude, your are just so hot…”
Can’t believe he got away with the shoe tying.
Good win…but we have to look at next game. Minnesota coming of a win against the Jazz with Love back in the lineup. Need to keep up the effort.
The shoe thing, should be named as the play of the year! I mean how? That was the most amazing thing I saw, and the most disgraceful thing to see if you are a Bulls fan. We purely owned them tonight.
First blow out of the year for us! God I have missing these moments sooo much!
Go RAPS!
We should be able to win our next five games and get over .500. The only hurdle is that we have to play Atlanta again, but at least we get them at home.
Calling it from now: Revenge will be sweet! Gosh just want the raps to go out and show them what we are made of!
Didnt see the Derozan dance…. He’s lucky Noah fouled out (2 T’s) early he probably would have beat the crap out of him if he saw that crap again. I hate to see poor sportmenship; especially because of the Boston incident of years past (Them playing golf on the bench….F***ing Pricks). Derozan needs to stay grounded and remember he isnt bigger than the game…
DeRozan just danced a little for the camera when the music was going during a timeout. It was in the midst of the bench having fun and laughing. I really don’t think he thought it would be disrespectful.
yeah i dun think he meant it in a bad way. I found it very funny actaully, but as funny as Turk just pushing him away like a lil kid. Now, the JJ shoe tieing was meant as a disrespect, and just a humiliation. And deserving so, it is one of the biggest humiliations I have seen in sports. It is kind of like knifing someone in CS when you are running in front of them, and they are shooting at you for 10 seconds, and they even land a bullet on you…
No way the shoe-tying was meant as a disrespect. His shoe was undone, so he did it up. The Bulls could have pressured him, and he would have had to call a timeout. They didn’t, so JJ tied up his shoe. You can sprain an ankle or something if your shoes aren’t tight, or if it came off altogether you can slip and fall.
DD dancing maybe in context of the music etc was not so bad, but given LeBron’s antics, he should have had more sense. I didn’t see it. But he is 20 year-old, rookie, his first blowout, and Hedo showed him the classy way to win. And Hedo has been part of any number of solid wins with Howard and the Magic. Good job.
Or some douche could throw your shoe off the court (ahem, ron ron)
+1000 for the CS knifing reference. But I still think it’s more satisfying to sneak up on someone and shank em in the back.
…which many that comment on this site claim is disrespectful to the Raptors when done to them.
yeah man good point.. no big deal
Good article. Didn’t see the game but I like the victory and I gotta say tieing your shoe mid game (I just saw the highlight) is just awsome. I’m not sure if he did it as a punk out but it just reeks of swagger, which we have been missing. Stats say Bosh=monster -I am beiginning to get on the lets saint him/MVP bandwagon- and Bargs continues to rebound at a good rate. Bellineli’s line makes me want to forgive him for the awful games we’ve seen lately and DeRozen (again higlights) looks like he had a fantastic first quarter.
Damn Alt, you seriously dated yourself with the Brand Nubian Beats… that shit had me reminiscing about years gone by, thanks man…
Me too. Sadly, I had that earmarked for a while but had to wait for a Raptors blowout.
I think your allowed to state – Under The Bus: N/A.
Nobody deserved to be under the bus tonight.
Even in a blow out, somebody plays poorly.
You saying nobody deserved to drive it when we played Atlanta?
We got killed in ATL, thus everybody deserved to be under the bus, including Bosh.
And nobody deserved to be driving it in ATL, NOBODY!
So DeRozan’s season high was meaningless? He’ll be sorry to hear that.
Yep. Season highs in a loss are completely meaningless. Especially a loss like that. For the same reason that Mike James’ 20 PPG was meaningless. I could give DeRo some dap if it was close.
That makes zero sense.
To say that nobody plays well or accomplishes anything in a loss is just ignorant.
I think if you take the first part within the context of “especially a loss like that”, it makes a lot more sense.
It’s the same rationale as all the hate when a player puts up points when the game is no longer on the line. Or when there’s no longer a playoff spot to contend for. Is it really that hard to accept that DeRozan would not have posted the stats he did if it was actually a close game? So far, DeRozan’s two best games scoring-wise have been games with extended garbage time. Not all that impressive, really.
As a frequent critic of Bargnani, I don’t really have a problem with the way he played tonight. 8 boards in 29 minutes and pretty solid defense. He also made a sweet pass to Amir, who fumbled the ball. Not a stellar night, but I’d much rather he play like this, and score only 9 points, than get torched, give up offensive boards and score 20.
I agree, but it makes me wonder, if they didn’t need jack diddly squat from him tonight except rebounds and defense…why do the Raps need him at all? Why does this Raps team need a guy that needs 15 shots per night to be effective? Don’t they have enough, and better, shooters for that? I’d rather give guys like DDR, Turk, and Jose Bargs’s shots. Not to mention Bosh. OK, I just did mention Bosh. Um, he’s totally unstoppable. Why should the Raps take shots away from him and give them to a much less efficient scorer like Bargs? The Raps need more players that don’t need the ball to be effective.
How is Bargs all of a sudden a less efficient scorer than Hedo, DeRozan, Jose? Do you know anything about basketball? Hedo has never shot as high a percentage as Bargs shoots. Also Bosh is not as good a shooter but usually has a higher overall percentage because he’s close to the hoop and Bargnani shoots a fair amount of threes. Bosh would not get so many good looks and neither would Jose or DD and Turk for that matter if Barnani did not spread the floor and defense for them.
Bosh’s shooting percentage is less relevant because he gets to the line so much and grabs more rebounds than almost anybody in the league, while almost never turning the ball over.
Turk shoots a lot less than Bargs, and creates for others.
DDR’s shots tend to be alley-oops dunks and has been getting to the line a lot the past couple of games.
Jose is a very efficient player with very few turnovers, he creates for others and typically shoots an extremely high percentage. Like Turk, Jose shoots less than Bargs.
The ball almost always stops at Bargs. When he gets it, he shoots it. He doesn’t try to create for others much, although he’s shown he can do that. He doesn’t get to the line much because he doesn’t drive to the hoop or play inside as much as he clearly is capable of. His defensive and rebounding mistakes hurt the team more than he usually helps it. As good as he gets at that end, he’ll never be the player Okafor is. And that’s what the Raps really need to be a contender.
He actually did pass up a shot attempt tonight and passed the ball…to DeRozan(!).
I had to check my pulse to ensure I was still alive.
Where’s turnover4thbosh the last two games?
Brandon you and I are ok to have different opinions and no problem with who you like versus who I like etc.. But if you’re going to make statements to back up your likes you should make sure they’re right.
Bosh does turn the ball over more than Bargs as does Hedo by a wide margin and Jose about the same as Bargs. Also Bosh would turn the ball over even more if he actually attempted to pass out of double teams because he’s yet to learn how to pass.
Turks shoots about 20% fewer shots than Bargs and about the same points per shot and gets more assists but is hardly stellar there and has only recently had a few good games.
Jose shoots less than Bargs and actually should because he’s supposed to create for others and make the whole team better yet averages just over 6 assists per game.
DDr is a great talent with tons of upside but you cannot compare based on two games.
Also the ball never stops at Bargs..that’s Bosh’s turf. Bargs either passes, shoots, or drives right away keeping the offence flowing.
Bargs leads the team in free throw percentage by a wide margin,scores pretty much as many points per shot as anyone on the team, leads the team in blocks.
I didn’t mean this to slam any player as Bosh has been terrific, and I love DD, and Jose is getting better as is Hedo but to continually slam Bargs is bs.
By the way I would estimate Bargs actually touches the ball maybe 60% less than Bosh as well since he’s looked off so much.
Pizzaman,
Not sure where you are getting your numbers, but Bosh and Bargnani turn the ball over at exactly the same rate, despite Bosh getting far more touches. Per 36 mpg, both turn the ball over 1.8 times a game. Turkoglu turns the ball over lightly more (2.3 per game), but since he handles the ball so much and initiates the offense, that’s not a bad number at all. Calderon, obviously is the best in the league at not turning the ball over, so you can’t criticize him.
As for passing, Bosh gets more assists than Bargnani and Hedo gets nearly four times as many as Bargnani.
And both Bosh AND Bargnani have had a problem with stopping the ball on offense. Did you not hear about teammates griping about Bargnani doing this last season, which made them reluctant to pass to him? Both do it less this season, but a lot of times the ball stops at Bosh because, well, he’s the Raptors best scorer and tends to score more of the time he tries to. You may not have watched a lot of other teams but the same things happens with LeBron, Carmelo, Kobe, etc. You don’t want to happening excessively, but, for the most part, that hasn’t happened this year.
Yes, Bargnani is the team’s best free throw shooter, but he also doesn’t get there nearly as much as he should considering how many shots he takes. That’s the main reason for his inconsistent scoring.
Pizzaman, the numbers I’m using are right here:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/TOR/2010.html
The advanced stats say that Bosh’s TOV% (the percentage of possessions that end in a turnover by that player while he’s on the floor) is 7.7. If you compare that to other all-star forwards you’ll see how magnificent that is. Kevin Garnett: 11.2; Carmelo: 10.0; Dirk: 6.6; Duncan 11.2 and so on and so forth.
I agree with Tim that Joakim Noah, my favourite player, is what the Raps need at the 5. But Okafor would be excellent too, and he’s more available. Bargs isn’t tradeable until the summer because he’s a PPP player with the new contract and everything. And would anyone want to trade for him?
He divides the locker room, turns the players against the coaches, causes disharmony and dissension because he gets special treatment, hurts team chemistry, sabotages team defense, and produces inconsistent offense. And his contract extension is outrageous. I think the Raps hang onto him until he eventually is bought out by a Euro team.
“He divides the locker room, turns the players against the coaches, causes disharmony and dissension because he gets special treatment, hurts team chemistry…”
How could you possible know any of that? Unless you can provide evidence of any of this its complete an utter speculation.
That’s because Brandon is really Patrick O’Bryant’s little known alias, and this libel is part of his diabolical plan to usurp some of Bargnani’s minutes.
While I do agree that Bargnani’s outside hooting opens things up for everyone else, I would rather have a high energy defender/rebounder playing beside Bosh rather than Bargnani. A Joakim Noah, for instance, would take a lot of pressure off Bosh defensively, and his ability to rebound would help as well. Right now, Bosh generally takes the opposing team’s best big man because he’s a better defensive player than Bargnani. Someone like Noah, while not attracting the attention offensively, would still be a threat because of his ability to clean up Bosh’s misses.
And as for Bargnani’s efficiency, his true shooting percentage is actually less than both Calderon and even Turkoglu, right now. And both Bosh and DeRozan get to the line at a high rate, so are more efficient scorers. Bargnani started the season fairly hot, but has cooled considerably in the last few weeks.
timothy u love bargs.
Wrong look up the stats
Pizzaman,
I did look up the stats.
True shooting percentage as of today.
Bosh: .575
Bargnani: .577
Calderon: .603
Turkoglu: .580
DeRozan: .532
And for interest sake:
Belinelli: .574
Jack .538
Wright: .410
Weems: .370
Tim W. your stats are pretty good but you do embellish them somewhat to make your point. Hedo has about three times as many assists as Bargs not 4 times or he would have almost five assists per game which he does not he has 3.8 as he should because he’s supposed to be a playmaker.
You say Bosh and Bargs have the same amount of turn overs yet Bargs actually has a minute percentage less, yet when Hedo has a shooting percentage that is 3/1000 better than Bargs you mention it as better…gimme a break. Also I think Bosh is great but again please do not compare him to LeBron, Carmelo, Kobe or Wade because he’s not close to their class. Those players you mention can do almost everything on a court better than Bosh..all shoot better, pass better,take free throws at a better clip, defend better,dribble and control the game better, and just about whenever they want to they dominate a game which Bosh has only done a small percentage of the time.
Again nothing against Bosh he’s a great player but no where near where you put him which is why this team plays better when he’s not everything.
Pizzaman,
Bargnani averages, per 36 minutes, 1.2 apg. Hedo averages 4. It may have been a long time since I took math in school, but last time I did, I’m pretty sure that was a lot closer to 4 times than 3.
As for the other stuff, I was going by the per 36 minutes, which evens things out a bit, since Bosh averages more minutes per game than Bargnani.
And I wasn’t talking about how good Bosh’s all around game is in comparison to LeBron, Kobe etc. My point, and I think you understood this, was that ON OFFENSE, when top scorers like Bosh, Carmelo etc, get the ball, it often stops because they are the teams best scorer. Have you ever watched a Cavs game? LeBron is a superb passer, but it often stops when it gets to him, because he’s also scoring nearly 30 ppg. In the past, and Bosh has admitted this, Bosh used to hold the ball a bit much, but, for the most part, he’s much better this year. When the offense is firing, he’ll move the ball, but when the team has trouble scoring, he’ll look for his shot a lot more, as he should.
Thank you! Finally someone paying attention . Jam
The Raps could use a guy like Bargs because it won’t beevery night that we play the bulls and torch them. There will be days that Bosh is off (even Kobe has off days) or that he is being guarded by someone who shuts him down on Offence (ex: KG used to do that just about everytime they played) and they need another scorer who gets mismatches alot (ex: Bags can completely burn Perkins). “Now you may ask ok but can’t Hedo or Belli pick up the scoring if Bargs is gone” or “yah but how often is Bosh going to get shut down”. Those could be legitimate points. So the other reason I’ll give to why we shouldkeep Bars is that there are still a number of people (or maybe its just me) who feel that Bargs is still improving as a player. Rebounding is better, his offence is diversifing and over the last two games we are seeing some defense coming into the game. So I guess my thing is if you have a very good developing player who provides mismatches for everyone do you really want to get rid of him? Most of you will probably say yes to that and state you’d rather get out of the first round of the playoffs to which I will reply I think we can do that with him on the team assuming he continues to grow.
Who would you rather have – Bargs or Oden? I was amazed to see how many people would make that trade but I’m not amazed that Oden is out for another season while Bargs just misses another double double.
I’d rather take a healthy Oden, but that’s not going to happen, is it?
And Oden has one more double double than Bargnani, but playing nearly ten minutes less a game.
Oden: 11.7 ppg, 8.8 rpg and 2.4 bpg on .604 shooting in 24.9 mpg
Bargnani: 17.1 ppg, 6.4 rpg, 1.1 bpg on .473 shooting in 34.1 mpg
Of course, right now, I’d take Iverson over Oden. Okay, maybe not.
I am amazed how everyone underrate Bargs play… We got a true big last, and you saw what happened… And how the hell is Hedo a more “efficient” scorer than bargs? The guy literally forces every shot he takes. Although I would rather have a luis scola or a Joah play along side bosh, I would not give up Bargs to get any of them. Barg’s value is much higher than that, specially since he has got 7 year left in his contract and each year lower than 10 mill. Now just compare Hedo’s 10 M/year to Bargs 10m/year in two year…. Hedo is our worst signing of the summer. The best guy to get in summer was Shawn Marion.
The last time the Raptors got a true big, they had very little talent around he and Bosh, which is the reason the team failed.
Bargnani would be more valuable if he were a more consistent scorer and rebounder, an average defender and blocked people out once in a while. SImply put, Bargnani can, and often does, hurt the team more often than a player who doesn’t give up points like Bargnani tends to.
There are lot’s of Bargnani haters out there – And of they have no idea about what they are talking about. (Or they are just sh*t disturbers like Altraps – really “under the bus” 4-10 shooting, 9 points, 8 boards – let’s pretend to be serious)
Barg’s plays better man defense than Bosh, but worse help.
Bosh plays worse man but better help.
Sometimes that makes the Raps the most porous defense out there – but it depends on match-ups. The Bulls are a GOOD match-up for the Raps, the Celtics are not!
Notice teams with a good scoring big go after Bosh and that often gets the Raps in trouble.
If the Raps want to change this dynamic, they can hope Bargs learns to help bail out Bosh better or Bosh changes to be be a better defender or one of them is traded.
(Worst solution is Bosh walks as a FA for nothing)
“There are lot’s of Bargnani haters out there”
Most of them play for the Raptors.
brothersteve,
Bargnani’s man-to-man defense is better than Bosh’s in only some matchups. Bosh has done a better job this season of guarding big, strong centers like Howard and Kaman, because he doesn’t give up as deep post position as Bargnani (who has always struggled with that). Bargnani does better against finesse post players because of his length. Bosh’s extra strength has served him well this season on defense.
Would have said Oden before last night. The guy was starting to look like he might be able to be the next Howard. Now not so much.
Excellent effort on a back to back to get the early lead and did not let chicago get back in it. We should be able to win the next to games this week if we play like today, can’t wait to see the huskies jersey on Tuesday.
P.S the clean shaven Marco looks like a darker kapono-ukic hybrid of sorts, IMO.
Chris Bosh
25 PTS
12 REB
1 BLK
all in 22 min…….. unreal……
i seriously hope he doesn’t leave in 2010… because this season he has proven to be Toronto’s best player in franchise history… gotta make him stay Colangelo… gotta make him stay…
Bosh is showing that he has elevated this game and is proving that he can maintain this improvement for an entire season consistently game after game.
All I want from the rest of the players on this team is simply have them play up to their current ability as consistently has Bosh has been doing to see how good this team really is.
As simple as that is, it’s really all everyone wants from their team.
Agree. It’s ok if the starters have the occasional off game – it happens. But part of being mentally tough is the ability to dig down and do the simple things first and then build off of that. Feel that with that loss in Phoenix Raps could have really used that effort (controlled the tempo, bench contribution, starters competing evenly or better against Phoenix’s starters, etc.) to be the springboard for their season. Didn’t happen.
Shows that with everyone contributing (for the most part) the Raps can compete against the elite teams. Whether they can dreg that effort up enough times over the next couple months will be the most telling challenge.
“DeRozan – seemed to have a chip on his shoulder when he came out, huh Jay?”
Well, then Jay should keep doing what he’s been doing with the rookie, then. It’s hard to fault Jay when DeRozan is playing like he is. Obviously Jay’s been doing something right.
Speaking of DeRozan, his ability to get to the line is very impressive. The last 12 games, his free throw attempts is more than half his field goal attempts. That’s Dwayne Wade territory.
Yup. To put it into perspective, DeRozan’s output isn’t very different from McGrady’s during his rookie season. Similar shooting percentages and PPG. McGrady had more rebounds and was a better passer and defender. DeRozan, interestingly, is going to the line at a better rate.
Except that DeRozan hasn’t exhibited the laziness that plagued McGrady throughout his time in Toronto (and the rest of his career).
I honestly could not tell whether it was laziness or his droopy eyelids, when McGrady was a Raptor. =P
Word is that McGrady’s always been a bit of a lazy player, which is why he never became the player he could have been. And has never been out of the first round, despite having all-world talent.
no, his numbers would be much better if Triano would give him the minutes he deserves.
DDRs success has NOTHING to do with Jay Triano.
Thats like saying his success in Feb/March last year at USC was due to Tim Floyd benching him in the fall AND not due to the fact that he was the top ranked highschool player in the country 6 months earlier.
dude just has skills…period…and a serious motor.
he *should* be playing 25-32 minutes a night and in which case he should also be averaging something like 12pts, 6boards, 2-3 assts, and a block every night. Which would be pretty good for your 5th option.
I’m not sold DD should be playing that much…. when he is on in games yes maybe, but there will be alot of games when he is off.
He’s still a rookie on a team expects to be in the playoffs. Its one thing if he was on the Nets where expectations for this year are low, its another on a team that wants to be in the playoffs.
Its not meant to be a knock on DD, he is showing much more over the past week than early in the season, but until he can do this consistently and keep his stamina up (which few rookies are able to do), his minutes will need to be monitored.
Nothing could be worse than DD playing like this all season, just to hit a the rookie wall come crunch time.
I disagree. When he’s on, he’s on, but more often than not, he’s completely invisible. I don’t know how you can propose 32 minutes for someone like that, a rookie no less, just one year removed from high school. McGrady averaged 18 minutes a game in his rookie season. Granger averaged 14. Both were better prospects than DeRozan (in my opinion, at least). I’d much rather he concentrate on not picking up bad habits, than trying to pick up stats his first year in the league.
Raptors played very very well tonight Bosh was a beast in only 22 minutes of action.
In other news Greg Oden is done for the season injured his fracturing his left patella. Here’s the injury looks real bad
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stYZMOvFGcA
Wow. Poor guy. Is he going to have a Sam Bowie-like career? Hope not.
I know this guy’s potential was really high now these knee injuries have cut that potential in half. I really feel for the guy, it would be great if he truly became a great player in this league.
Oh man that’s awful. All you hear about is how sweet of a dude he is too. Look at Roy/someone grabbing his hand in the vid too: that’s guy-love.
I have no problem with derozan dancing as long as we are blowing out the other team (if lebron can do it why can’t he do it ) cause if we were getting blown out by other teams will they will be lauging, dancing and playing golf.
Man, 4-10, 9 points, 8 rebounds in 28 minutes – you got a hate on for Bargs?
Johnson 2 pts, 2 boards. Foul trouble. Not a fan of +/- but a +1 in a blowout
No, but it’s fun to stir the pot and poke the bear. Thanks for noticing.
Did you watch the game? What did you think of his effort compared to the rest of his teammates?
I compared Barg’s stats to Johnson’s.
Believe I already answered your question.
End of 3rd qtr. with Bosh on the bench, on 3 consecutive offensive possessions Bargs parks himself behind the 3 pt. line right side (like a pylon). He set a couple of picks and then went back to the same spot. He was given the ball once, took a shot which missed. On the other 2 possessions there were rebounds which he was obviously not in a position to snag because the guy doesnt even follow the play and go to the rim when someone else takes a shot. The guy just seems to be not focused on a consistent basis. It is amazing…and infuriating. He is really going to alienate the team if he doesnt pull his head out of his arse. He gets a pass tonite because of the score but during close games that is really terrible playing…a small sequence though it was. He should have been the primary rebounder with Bosh out.
Oh, I’m sorry, does Bargs write up the offensive sets?
He could certainly crash the glass more, but where he’s standing on the floor is entirely Triano’s fault.
As much as it seems stupid to criticize the league’s best offence, I really think the Raps gotta get Bargs more touches consistently. Not necessarily more shots, but for stretches of several minutes he won’t even touch the ball.
I’m sure the lack of glass crashing is also a coaching decision, just like Calderon going under every screen.
Oh..and what makes you so sure it is a JT thing? Guess you havent been reading the quotes lately (eg Jack & Wright) who while beating up on Triano were obvious about Bargs being the problem. I have seen Bosh get pissed at him on the floor. Tonite with a 30+ lead he still stands behind the arc…we did not need his 3 ptrs…just play an inside defensive game with Bosh out.
Hey, his offence in not a problem. He manages to drag out the opposing big man to make room for Bosh to operate. The knock on Bargs is his help defence and defensive rotations.
To quote you “Tonite with a 30+ lead he still stands behind the arc…we did not need his 3 ptrs…just play an inside defensive game with Bosh out.”
You talk about “offence” in the first part of the sentence and then you suddenly bring up “defence” towards the end. Mae up your mind.
I think he is a type of player who works on thing one-at-a-time. He started with his offence first. Then he worked on his man defence. Now he is working on his rebounding which is coming along pretty nicely, he still lets a lot of rebounds slip/fumble out of his hands. Hopefully, he’ll start putting little help defence and proper-defensive-rotation in his games as the season goes along.
Coach Triano is making interesting defensive substitutions when te team needs some defence. Sends a clear single to Brags that his defence needs a lot of work. And Brags does have that look about him which says that he loves challenges.
As I stated earlier, Jack and Wright are in no position to call anyone out.
Haha, it’s hilarious that Jack and Wright rip the team for poor defense and fans then conclude:
1) Obviously the Europeans are at fault because they didn’t rip anyone (certainly not a cultural thing there…);
2) They must be ripping Bargnani for his offense of all things (Wright rips Bargnani for his offense? Seriously?).
Maybe I’m one of the few here, but when I hear Jack/Wright/Bosh ripping others for their defense without accepting blame as well, I don’t think wow, what a leader! None of them have played that well on the defensive side. Every team has poor defensive players; you don’t post historically poor defensive numbers because of just a few players.
So Bendit thinks the authorities on what is right and wrong are Wright who has pretty much stunk the joint out most nights and should shut the f. up, and Jack who has had maybe five good games since he got here!!
Smart observations!! And if you ever played competitive sports you would know that players positioning other than the odd error is deliberately set by the coaches because of their game plan, not by a 23 year old kid.
It’s like people think these guys just go and stand around where they want, well a lot has to do with where coach tells me to stand, maybe people should start ripping the coaches. Jam
As much as I hate seeing Wright anywhere near the ball on the offensive end Deng was invisible when Antoine was on him. As soon as Hedo steps in Deng was getting to hole (getting shut down when he got there but at least touching the ball). I wasn’t buying the whole Wright as a stopper thing but he seemed to do a good job tonight, even if you gotta down it with a spoonful of salt.
Also Bargs played good enough tonight, not deserving of being under the bus. Two of those misses were “Oh my God, why did he pass me the ball at the three point line and with two seconds left on the shot clock” jacks. Also he was only invisible when Bosh was on the floor: he did his job boxing out, setting 100% of the high screens and popping out the three point line to draw out Noah/Taj and make room for Bosh to be monstrous on the inside. Actually, this is why I feel he disappears from games. When was the last time Bosh set the high screen and Bargs got to set up position on the inside, come off a screen and take a jumper or flash/cut?
Obviously it makes no sense to do it that way when Bosh and Bargs are on the floor together, with Bargs outside it puts Bosh in a position to do what he’s best at: clean up the misses and or score inside/draw a foul but I think that’s why it seems like Bargnani isn’t involved in offense for long stretches, only really taking bail out shots late in the clock.
As soon as Bosh took his final bow Bargs went straight inside, got the ball and missed a nice look, got it back from Johnson and missed a quick semi-turnaround – both great shots they just didn’t fall. For me this is the great argument for Bargs to be playing primarily with the second unit: just so we can use him properly.
I’ll continually say that Bosh is a big reason we don’t see Bargnani take it to the hole more.
I still think a play that works is to swing the ball to Bargs, foul line extended, have Bosh outside the key on the opposite side, Bargs either gets enough room to shoot or takes his man off the dribble…if the double comes, feed Bosh, if not, go up hard to the hoop for the jam, and 1, or the shooting foul.
I like that, it puts Bosh in position to clean up and gives Bargs a chance to get a little hot.
My crazy idea is to use Bargs like a 7-foot young Ray Allen when he is playing with Johnson (hyperbole obviously but stick with me for two seconds): Jack/Jose has the ball up top, Bargs is sitting on extended foul line. Johnson comes off the block to set a screen halfway between Bargs and the elbow, as soon as he gets a little bump on Andrea’s guy he rolls to the basket for a board or a quick pass. Bargs comes in gets the ball he either puts up a quick shot, takes a step and puts up a floater (he seems comfortable with those) or hits Johnson if the screen was good and Johnson’s man steps up on him. Throw in DeRozan or Wright cutting from the wing and you got a couple guys going at the basket on a shot that’s going in or coming off the rim short. If the screen was bad and Johnson’s man get up at Bargs, I trust him to be able to just pass it off.
Of course this is just crazy-fan talk, the fact I thought of it gives it 0% to work but I’d love to see it.
We have not seen much in the way of creative coaching in Toronto in years.
It would be nice to see 2 Raptors somewhere near the offensive glass making a play and cleaning up misses. (Instead of just watching other teams doing to the Raps)
Bargs under the bus? Disagree! He didn’t take the night off, worked the boards and did what he could.
Once again a chance to slam Bargnani as under the bus when he actually played a decent game. He was not an offensive force but shot 40% with a couple of late clock jumpers, and played very good defense with 8 boards in limited minutes. When Bargnani scores you criticize his rebounding. Now that he’s rebounding you call him under the bus because he only scored 9 points in a blowout. Get your head out of your ass. If you have to put anyone under the buss and this game it could have been the entire Bulls team but if you had to Amir was 0 for 3 with 2 rebounds and 2 points in 21 minutes. Both DeRozan and Hedo shot worse than Bargs at a .375 clip, both got less boards. Jose shot .400 like Bargs but only had 3 assists. Give us a break with all the Bargnani hate and give the kid a break too.
I have a new headline for you:
Driving the Bus: Chris Bosh and the Toronto Raptors starters
Under the Bus: Altraps and his useless post
I second that.
Yes, I’m with you.
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Agree – that any player on the Raps would be slammed after a 37 point victory is ridiculous. Will you guys only be satisied if we win every 130-70 with every player shooting 60%?
We should throw Altraps under the bus. His disdain and bias towards Bargnani is obvious in every roll call. Can we get a more objective writer for the post game rap?
If anyone should be under the bus, it was Amir. He had an off-game. Everyone’s hustle, including Bargnani’s and Rasho’s, made his hustle redundant, but with fewer fouls.
I have to think the only reason Bargs is under the bus is because you enjoy stirring the pot, or you have really really high expectations of him. He played solid D rotationally and on his man. He packed the paint, and had a couple of nice fakes and drives. I mean the offence was going off in every other way, wasn’t better Bargnani played some decent D? He also did not play in the 4th, when he seems to get most of his points. He got 6 defensive boards against a good boarding team, and shot 40%.
I am as critical of Bargnani, I think, as most people are. But this was not an under the bus performance – no way.
Look above at my response to comment 14, if you hadn’t/haven’t looked already.
Amir had a poor game as well, I agree. However, as a whole, and also seeing somewhat the same as what Bendit (see above) saw, his constant regression mid-game is poisonous.
How was Andrea’s shooting percentage compared to the rest of the starters, out of curiosity?
I missed that one! I still think he didn’t deserve such a poor rating though. I mean, everyone was shooting well, and he took somewhat of a backseat on offence. I have no real problem with that. I also didn;t see any plays run to give him open looks – he created for himself all night. Not his best game, for sure, but Amir was worse.
Anyway, consider the bear poked – just make sure it isn’t too hard, or you will get a lot of tomato sauce and penne rigate comin’up!
Hedo 3-8, DD 3-8, JC 2-5.
You scientists of the b-ball are really great! And then you wonder why in the US they don’t take the Raps and its fans seriously…LMAO.
You couldn’t tell a man defence from a zone one, but you think you invented the game, and you spit your hate sentence day in day out. Get real, and focus your rage to the wii console or something.
If you’re going to put someone under the buss you might actually take a minute to look at the shooting percentage instead of posting then asking. Show’s your real motive.
Andrea shot 4 of 10 – I think its complementary of you for you to consider it a bad shooting night. One shot away from 50%.
When the team defence stinks Bargnani gets more than his share of blame. The last two games our D has been good. No love for the big guy.
Andrea shooting percentage was the same – he can’t hit 1/2 a shot!
“How was Andrea’s shooting percentage compared to the rest of the starters, out of curiosity?”
Tied for second best, if you want to look at it that way. Cause, you know, 3/8 is 37.5%, and 4/10 and 2/5 are the same. =P
AltRaps
You should just stop. You bring up points for us to reference and they kill your point.
Think before speaking and if you still feel you have a point to make —-Think Again.
“I have to think the only reason Bargs is under the bus is because you enjoy stirring the pot, or you have really really high expectations of him”
If it is because of really high expectations, then every game he should be under the bus, because outside of the first game he has not lived up to such a standard.
The Raptors desperately need consistent effort from all their starters. When Jose is not attacking he gets exposed. When Bosh is not on or keeping an offensive flow when double teamed the team regresses. Bargs needs to “make sure” he rebounds, rotates and blocks out. It’s a given his offense will (for the most part) be there.
If any two Raptors dont play well on a given night there’s a high probability they won’t win until they are more familiar with each other and understand how to tough out wins when things aren’t going that well. The 47-win season showed it is possible.
Man-o-man …. I shouldn’t watch Raptors games more often. I’ve missed the last two and look at each outcome. ;)
Anyhow, I was glad we took advantage of a team that down right now in the Bulls. Not only did we beat them, we also put on a clinic. :D
Like most of the team said “That was only 2 games now”
The Bulls are a good match-up for the Raps’ bigs. No Bulls are real scoring threats. Raps bigs should (and did) be able to take it to the Bulls.
Want to see the Raps keep winning.
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I’ll start by saying I like the Roll Calls.
But I’ll also say …. you need to change your bias with Bargs – it’s annoying, and tiring. Frankly – it affects your analysis.
To say that Andrea was under the Bus is absolute BS. Amir — maybe. Bargnani shot 4 of 10 (with 2 shots – I believe — being at the end of the clock). He tended to defer to other players, and concentrate on those parts of his game that we know needs improvement. We also know he’s one of our best shooters, which is why I don’t worry when he has a bad Offensive game. Or doesn’t take a lot of shots – LIKE tonight’s game.
As for who’s driving the Bus, or under the Bus, I personally think the WHOLE FUCKING team played good, and that you need to give the Bargnani thing a rest.
That’s one of the problems with Toronto fans — Nothing is good enough. It’s like fans booing VC – to which he responds in a killer fashion. Do they really know what they’re doing, when they incite top level play from the opposition. Carter gets motivated when we yell and scream, and call him an Ass.
I know part of reason you diss Andrea, is to stir the pot, but that gets tiresome. And your analysis should not be tainted by how some people treat your perspectives. There will always be idiots who disrespect your viewpoint – just ignore them.
I’m with you on one point – I’m not here to listen to whiners, or whatever. I come to this site to read why we lost, what we need to change, and whatever it is the Raptors need to focus on, to become a top team. I’m hear to learn more about Basketball. And determine things like whether a Phoenix type team can win it all.
There are times when I think you have this impression that certain Rap fans see Andrea & Chris in an equal light, which seems to bring out that bias. Not the case – everyone with an IQ over 50 knows Bosh is a superior player. But Bosh’s salary is 2.4 times that of Bargnani’s, so I expect not just a superior game (which I see), but a leader, which I don’t quite see – yet. These last few games, Bosh has shown how to will a team to win, but I need more games before I’ll jump on that wagon. I`m harder on Bosh, because I expect more.
Anyways, I’d just like to enjoy these last couple of wins (and hopefully a couple more coming), before the carcass of our next loss gets picked over.
And sorry for the rant – but as you can judge from some comments, it would be nice to get a perspective that has a little more optimism, than what’s been displayed.
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Well said… It would be a shame if this site turned into more of a Bosh Camp vrs Bargs Camp type of forum. That argument is old and well beaten. The site is like that to some extent already but I am hoping that the silent majority of those that frequent this site are edjumacated enough to realize that both players have postives and negatives and as RapthoseLeafs states the expectations of the two players are very different.
2cents deposited
well said.+1…bush league stuff, rr should be embarrassed.
and while your at it lay off Banks and POB it’s tiresome, hey at least they made it to the NBA, something 99.99% of the population couldn’t do.
I agree. I don’t mind ripping dudes who have been on the floor. But come on…you tear these guys to pieces who don’t even get playing time on the lowly Raptors.
Well said but useless. These guy have their mind made up for the season, despite reality, b-ball and common sense. Some of Raps fans? Probably the worst in the league by comparison. And let me tell you, this blog used to be good, but it’s getting really difficult to keep on reading it for some of the BS you constantly find in it. Disgusting.
site is doing fine, i like the content. i do miss arsenalist, i like his analysis the best though.
Well said. I defend Bargs alot but I realize Bosh is a superior player and expect him to be far superior for his money and his franchise status. As for the other starters there isn’t one guy any better all round than Bargs so there is definitely a hate on going on here. It’s as though everyone who has man love for Bosh has to slam Bargnani to make Bosh look even better. Bosh should be 3 times better because he makes that much more money and he’s the man.
Great effort again. This is how they CAN play. So hopefully they will keep it up. It feels great watching these guys play this way. Now the test is to maintain the effort and then apply it to top tiered teams. Baby steps. It’s a long season. Great start for DeRozan (my future favourite player) but he’s 19 and mega props for Turk from knocking him down a wrung and putting him in his place. All part of learning. Keep it up Lads!
Let me get this straight, Bargs shoots the lights out and gets killed for not pulling down boards and solid D. He then does both two straight games and now his shooting percentage is questioned? I guess he’s supposed to average 25ppg, 15 boards, 7 blocks, and 8 assists. Somehow I still don’t think people will be happy! He played under control in this one and had to force up a few shots late in clocks which skewed his percentages. On another note, DD is really starting to consistenly bring it. Haven’t seen slashing like this with the Raps for awhile.
the dude cant do nothing to appease the haters. they always find something wrong even when he does right. i never seen a player get so picked on. he’s the team whipping boy. he’s constantly begging for the ball in post position only to be ushered out to open up the paint yet some morons still think he’s a soft perimeter bigman who cant bang.its how he’s being used. idiots want him scoring dbl digits in boards but there isnt one team in the league with 2 players averaging dbl digit rebounds.
You’re right it’s like they live to slam the kid, and think he parks outside because that’s what he wants. He’s where he is and plays like he does because that’s where the coaches put him. When they said he doesn’t go inside it’s the coaches decision, and when he fights to get there he gets overlooked more often than not even though he’s become an efficient scorer down low. IOf they gave him the ball in the post more the team would also improve because more opposing bigs would get fouls and Bargs is as good as most free throw shooters in the league.
Most of the bashers think it’s street ball and Bargnani runs around and stands wherever he feels comfortable rather than where the coaches tell him to play. He’s where he is because the team centers around Bosh and the choice is to keep the middle open most times.
So the fact that Bryan says that he has to be a better rebounder for this team to be succesful has nothing to do with it? He is one of the worst rebounders in the leauge amoung power forwards and centers. You become a better rebounder by being close to the basket, look at Dirk’s rebounding numbers. Bottom line is on one of the worst rebounding teams in the leauge he has to start doing the little things that it takes to win not just play offense, and disrupt the offensive flow by him needing to get shot’s off. He neeed a better mid-range game, thats why he is one of the worst on the +/- scale he should not be attacking from the three point line, his handles arent that good hense he is picking up a lot of offensive fouls and turnovers.
bargs has 143 boards so far on the season. not bad at all. he’s right there with kevin garnett,jermaine oneal,al jefferson and has more boards then kmart,varajao,chuck hayes,haslem,lebron,durant,al harrington and the birdman to name a few….he also leads our team in blocked shots and has a stunning .882 ft% and other then these last 2 games he’s been an uber efficient scorer shooting at a .471 clip….he’s currently ranked 18th overall statistically in the entire league whereas bosh is ranked 7th. thats a pretty good 1/2 punch no? yet,people are brainwashed by tools like timothy and altraps and weak blogger wannabees who spread misinformation and denigrate his skills as if it were fact because they just dont like him. what else can explain the disdain? his stats tell another story and his game is dissected like no other baller in raptor history to make the kid seem unappealing….lol,clowns…im glad we have bargs at his contract.
Trugoy well said!!’Brakeman1 you know squat and are biased by Euro hate.
Not that +/- matters much, but which +/- scale are you referring to?
Do you mean +/- per 48 minutes? He has the third best +/- per 48 on the team (-2.2, behind Turkoglu’s +0.4 and Belinelli’s -1.5).
Do you mean the the on-court/off-court differential? He’s second on the team in that regard (+9.8, behind Turkoglu’s 17.7).
Which is it? Just wondering.
JO (of twin towers fame) stats are pretty good down in Miami , yet him and Bosh could not get the Raptors offense going and defensively they were not any better than what Andrea and Bosh are doing right now .
Stop comparing Bosh to Andrea they both bring their unique brand of basketball to the table and Andrea game continue improving one small step at the time.
Still waiting on JO’s knees to give out again. Sorry Miami, your season depends on an aging vet with bad knees.
It’s more than likely JO will miss significant time due to injury again this year, but he deserves better.
JO was a good player here when he was a 100% & he tried hard all the time, even when hurting. If he could have played most of his games at 100% last year, the Raps likely would have done pretty good. But we’ll never know.
I don’t know about that. Seems like every time an injury prone Raptor leaves down, they grow healthier. Carter missed more games by far as a Raptor. Even Mourning received a new lease on life after being bought out by the Raptors. Knowing our luck, I fully expect JO to play more games this season than expected.
another crappy roll call, Maybe the guy truly is one dimensional. In any event, we didn’t need your stinkin’ hatred today anyway, you big lug of goo.
maybe this year raptors will make the playoff, but their fans wont. they don’t deserve it.
man, you’re such a sore loser.
Altrap put your sister under the bus.
ouch. oh, that hurt. You…you…you….suck!
Funny how things happen. If the Raps don’t pull out that overtime win in Washington the night before, do they come out (and sustain it) last night with as much dominance and determination? Don’t know, but look at us now; finishing a road trip, 4 games in 5 nights at that, with back-to-back wins, the last being an emphatic blow-out that really suggests that ‘meeting’ cleared the air … and then some. Jaw dropping performance (once again) from CB4. I mean, holy cow! When he brings it like that (as he has, really, for most of this season) and the team plays like … a TEAM, all former ‘issues’ look like they’re far in the past. Like they’re starting to know how good they can be. Go Raps!
PS: so, is Arsenalist not going to write those brilliant analysis pieces I’ve so come to look forward to … at all, anymore? I do miss them.
He’s had a busy few weeks…he’ll be back.
altraps = the new khandor.
If it stirs up discussion, I have no issue with it.
Like him, it speaks volumes when I bring up points and the original commenter can’t/doesn’t answer them. A shame really. The discussion between Steve, Tim and myself should happen after every game. No name calling, a differing of opinion, and some brainpower. Nothing wrong with that.
no dude, like him you just make a fool of yourself
it takes a lot of self-esteem to think you can do something good with this useless and boring bashing… (even after 2 back-to-back away Ws)
ya know, with all your baskeball acumen, yours truly n2 are not able to realize what every player does during a match, in offensive and defensive sets.. our VL (is that how you call him?) sets tons of screen on the offence and takes care of the spacing, every single offensive sets starts with a high PnR with bargs, and regardless of this job he gets very few touches, even when he’s on fire. have you ever heard him complaining?
until the last two matches his defensive effort was dreadful. i totally agree. but in these last wins opposing teams had awful numbers inside the paint. wonder why? he grabbed 18 rebounds too (while your man bosh and turk rack up stats by stealing even bargs own rebs. have you ever seen him complaining?).
you, like khandor, are just professional whiners.
the point that you fail to realize is that, while the craptors were a joke for the first 20 matches, it seems they sort of turned the tide. this needs to be aknowledged. if it lasts, toronto is a legit nba team (and a playoff contender). because they always score 100+ with ease… if they keep showing just a plain regular defence like they just did…
Well said!
It’s been two god damn games against two less than stellar teams in matchups that clearly favored the Raptors going in. Turn the tide? You’re the joke.
When they show some toughness and defensive fortitude (I’m looking at you, Bargnani) against upcoming opponents Atlanta, Milwaukee, and Orlando, then maybe we can say they’ve begun to turn the tide.
Khandor always has some good points – even if I think he’s usually not quite correct.
But somehow we both had the Raps starting out 7-13 on the season. ???
Second game in a row that I watched more the the first half…..If this keeps up the wife is going to start to question whether or not I love her more then basketball….Not going to be pretty.
yeah wtf is going on?…i used to go to arsenalists site daily for a rap write up. now i have to be subjected to chewbaca rap fan a crackhead alt and the occasional dose of bad doctoring….can we have arse exclusively writing please?
sure, ask him. His email is available on the front office page. If, however, it would take away from your intelligent wit-filled comments that you have given us over the past few weeks, we’ll make sure he stays away.
+ 1
12/03:
“Bosh is quitting this team right before our very eyes. Shaq was right, teams are making him quit.”
- Trugoy
hey crackhead,prior to these last 2 games was he not?
andiamo..err…daniel…err…trugoy, leading the league in double doubles tells me that no, no he wasn’t. It also speaks to the fact that teams are and were not making him quit.
Playing “poorly” (for CB4) doesn’t mean he was quitting on the team.
But there was definitely some locker room issues and distractions prior to the last 2 games! Bosh sure wasn’t doing his best – and he wasn’t alone!
Whoa, what insight on that prediction.
If anyone would know about quitting on teams it is Shaq
Nah, he just rapes them of their soul and identity and then leaves them to die.
One of the positives that I took away from this game was that the Raptors did not let some C – D grade opposing player go off. Even in the W against Washington it seemed to me that Earl Boykins came off the bench and was a big factor in getting them back into that game (Not trying to pull hairs here, a W is a W, just saying). In the last couple of years it seems that these opposing role players come into the game and for one reason (Defense) or the other (Mindset playing against the Raptors) they seem to have some of the best games of their careers (See: J.J.Reddick, Matt Bonner, Earl Boykins etc.). Now I realize this is going to happen to even the best of teams from time to time, it just seems to happen to us more often than others, especially in the last couple of years. I don’t know if it was more because of our defense or because of the lack of depth of their bench (Gets pretty thin after Pargo/Miller) but it always encourages me whenever this doesn’t happen. Great Win by the Raptors, actually held on to the lead.
P.S. I wonder what Joakim what would have had to say about the Jack shoe thing to his Teammates and/or the Raptors if he hadn’t of gotten ejected, especially after the Lebron Dancegate incident the night before.
I am so sick of the Bargnani bashing! The kid is working hard to improve the part of his game that needs to be worked on. He is going through a stretch where his shot isn’t falling but he is a good shooter. Let’s not forget, he still is averaging 17 points a game and the rebounding numbers are going up. Give him a break
I completely agree that this post was far too hard on Bargnani. But I don’t think people realize what the Roll Call is, has been and will continue to be. Look back through old ones, and those who think everything in the Roll Call is changing all of a sudden are wrong.
It is humour, and controversy and a bit of asinine commentary, all to poke the bear. Live with it. When the post-games start to get super-biased (and some, a few of them, have) then complain.
You are a wise sage.
If nothing else, it proves that Raptors followers are passionate, which is great.
Will the real Raptors team step forward?
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Johnson only 3 fouls in 22 minutes but he still had more fouls than points and rebounds.
Can he be optioned to the D-League?
I think Amir’s limited minutes this game was a show of faith by Triano in a Amir more than anything. The only ‘regular’ that got heavy minutes was Jack and that was because we didn’t have another PG (I’m sure if Banks was suited up for this game he would have gotten plenty of burn). It goes to show that Triano expects regular minutes from him and doesn’t want to chance injury. He should take that as a serious compliment.
Atleast Amir’s fouls are from playing hard, fighting for the ball and helping out (most of the time). It would be nice to see him reduce his fouls but not at the cost of him backing down. If he gets fouls because he is fighting for the ball I can live with that.
re Amir’s fouls @ 3.5 per game, Turkoglu 3.2 and Andrea 3.4 make Amir look not that bad by himself. I don’t believe he has fouled out yet.
By minute there is an enourmous difference.
We need our front court to focus some more on D and we’ve been getting that to good results. We’ve had them both score and lose. I’m glad they are taking the challenge defensively. I like you altraps, but I tune out to your “analysis” after posts like this.
Look when Amir is in and we run our sets. D sags off him. No one sages off Bargs. That’s whey CB get’s room to turn and dunk, and if you notice when Bargs pops, it creates almost like a draft or current in the D the creates the lane for Jose. If the lane is closed, Jose hits Bargs for the three. Whether he’s shooting 40% or 60% is often just a matter of one or two shots dropping, or taking and end of clock three. Now he’s still being effective and doing other things even if he’s not on fire. Which is why he led the team in minutes in WAS. Was he under the bus then too?
It seems to me, that you, whether your do in consciously or not, put Bargs down as a means to protect or boost Bosh. They are on the same team though, and will not be successful unless the other is successful. Why as a fanbase we don’t realize this, and hope for one to at the cost of the other is silly. You guys have come along way, you should really evaluate you’re roll calls and consider whether the whole driving the bus, and under the bus is just a busch league item that the site has out grown. And preconceived idea that one of the team will be trashed after each game, speaks to the lack of real objectivity.
This is a team sport. We need our guys like POB, Banks, to play their roles, that not all guys could play. We should not kill them for that. If you want to straight comedy fine, but when you blur the lines, you kind of got a foot in both courts, kind of like a defender caught between helping and staying with his man an not doing much of anything, kind of like Andre was doing, which he hasn’t been. Which has been a big part of our recent success.
Sure, it’s a team sport that awards players of the weeks, months and years. It’s a team sport that allows fans and coaches to select single players to make up an all star game. It’s a team sport that regularly features writers speak about what players play poorly as well as those that play well.
Outside of Roll Call, the comment section is typically filled with comments about player XXX playing well in this game while player XXX played poorly. You saying we should shoot those comments down as well?
If it was consistently the same person put under the bus, then feel free to say we aren’t objective. At that point you will have an argument.
In all your responses you have yet to be able to defend your stupid commenst in role call other than to suggest you were stirring the pot which is bull. You cannot back anything up with facts and everyone other than the Bargs haters or Bosh lovers agrees. Stick to what really happens like Arsenalist tries to. He has bias but writes with real observation and commen sense and some partisanship, but yours is mostly bs and partisanship.
Not sure about that. I think if you ask around, the slim majority of people would say Bargs is pretty one dimensional. He’s looking to improve but I question if that is taking away from his decision making on the offensive side and resulting in his shots being off.
Also, if most agree that Bargs is indeed doing a quality job in his current role, why do most who have voted in the poll believe he should be the one moved to the bench? If he was playing well as currently situated, are you saying that the majority of readers are conspiring against him? Is Jay at fault for having him out there? Surely you know the answer.
First, 47% isn’t most, and the way you have the poll set up, “[...] he should be the one moved [...]” is not all that accurate considering the poll invited multiple choices.
And to be honest, when the team loses five in a row the way it did, “most” people would be happy replacing the entire starting lineup. Surely you’ve seen some of the suggestions. Jack, DeRozan, Weems, Bosh, Nesterovic. Jack, Turkoglu, Bargnani, Bosh, Nesterovic. Weems coming off the bench to play PF. I’m not about to take any of these seriously. Are you?
I do know the answer as you put it. It’s that many of you vote on stuff like that based on the last game or two. Do you remember how many people after beating Cleveland in game one said Bosh should focus on being the primary rebounder and secondary scorer letting Barg do the reverse. Unfortunately I don’t keep all your previous polls so I cannot quote them but recall many others saying Hedo was a bust, and sit Demar and Jose etc.. yet two good games by them and everything is alright.
You’re biased period. And by being like your idol Khandor you actually drive people who otherwise like Bosh into having to spill his poor qualities as well as others just to show you and others you’re wrong to pick on one guy.
“the slim majority of people would say Bargs is pretty one dimensional”
Now that’s pulling one out of your @ss. (I’m sure you’re got a poll – lol)
Polls are for dogs!
Polls aren’t written to get meaningful information – like the “under the bus” comment, they are just to create interest/discussion.
And YES Jay is at fault for how Bargs is being used/ or not used.
The Team and its fans ARE suffering from the inexperience of a rookie head coach – who just had to be bailed out by his GM. Jay had better learn FASTER.
Altraps, I think there is a general consensus now that you write posts about Bargnani with the sole purpose of causing discussion. I’m just wondering how you intend to ever have us take anything you write about him seriously from now on? I’m not so much concerned about a lack of bias -this is not a news site- as I am about losing faith in your wonderful commentary on the players performances.
Not hard to answer since not every Roll Call is entirely negative when speaking of Bargnani, just as not every one has been complimentary of Bosh.
Bulls Magic Pacers, just off the top of my head, Bargs played well. I think one of them was when he was ill as well, but that stretch showed what he should be doing almost every night.
Oh and I like your comentary as much as Arsenalists usually. I guess I just take theunder the bus thing too seriously. I mean, what if Bargs comes out after the game and is like “I wonder what altraps thought of my 8 rebounds. I bet I’m driving that bus today!” then he gets here and is like “now I am sad” and goes into a shooting slump. ;)
Callings Bargs “you big lug of goo” was beyond the pale.
Maybe that was supposed to be funny but it does reinforce the impression of a built in bias against Bargs – no matter what he does.
I dont want to suck up to anyone, but I hate when people complain about different things being written here like it’s their right to choose what when and who writes. They’ve payed big money, signed up for only one author, and now they are not getting it? How hard is it not to read the article/author if it’s pissing you off?
Lastly, and again, I do “miss” Arsenalist (well more like his articles), but I do like these other authors and I do read other stuff on here. Well everyone but phpsteve. But I don’t read his stuff and that’s it.
What a great guy I am :)
I love your writing. Thank you so much.