Channing Frye provided the daggers from deep, this one in the third quarter.Sometimes it hurts bad to lose a game and this one brought that hurt big time. A one point loss to the Suns when we easily could have and probably should have won. Turkoglu misses one at the buzzer capping off an evening that saw the Raptors compete at every level against the NBA’s best. Nobody had given the Raptors a chance in this one (including me) but they proved everybody wrong by giving a great effort that deserved better. There aren’t many moral victories to be had in the NBA but last night was one of them, we were an inch away from a win and should have had it if it hadn’t been for some execution errors in the strategy deployed to handle the pick ‘n roll.
I’m not sure what to make of switching on the Amare/Nash screen. I figure you try that out for a few possessions and if things work out, great, if they don’t you try other ways of stopping them. You definitely don’t let him go 10-15 FG, 10-11 FT, and have his short chart looking as concentrated as this. I don’t have an issue with the philosophy because it takes away penetration which means no wide open threes, but you also have to consistently provide help on the big once he gets the ball in the post, if you’re late on that it’s suicide. The Raptors strategy played right into Phoenix’s hands and even though we had some success with it, over the full 48 Phoenix was more than content to play along. Phoenix adapted well to Triano’s strategy and worked the advantage they were handed. Watching poor Jose Calderon get scored on from four feet over and over again was painful, he did pick up two steals by swiping the ball away but that was the highlight of that matchup. Triano explained it later:
It’s a team that feeds of penetrating and picks you apart on screen and roll action and kicks it for threes. We wanted to really restrict the number of threes that they took, that meant two guys had to score for them – Nash and Stoudemire – and they had to be two pointers for the most part. We were going to switch and stay up on guys, we knew we were going to have some mismatches inside but we had to come with some help. We didn’t want to come off shooters, it really restricts where you can help form.
Another resultant of this was a big being switched over to Nash as he victimized Bosh and Johnson on 16-footers early. Late in the fourth quarter it was Andrea Bargnani who was defending Nash with five fouls, something he did a solid job off despite visibly trembling; if he would’ve picked up his sixth foul that way, Triano would’ve had a lot of questions to answer. The big on small switches we gave up killed us and our refusal to alter our strategy despite Phoenix proving that they can beat us at it didn’t make much sense. Perhaps the effect was most felt by Phoenix’s wing quartet of Grant Hill, Jason Richardson, Leandro Barbosa and Jared Dudley who were a combined 8-for-28 from the field and struggled to get clean looks. However, Frye’s five threes offset any advantage gained.
Both team started the game on fire, Phoenix running everything through Nash who bailed them out in several short-clock situations and the Raptors going inside to Bosh against Stoudemire whose defense remains brutal. Bosh took him for 10 early points and Stoudemire did the same, only difference is that half of his came against Jose Calderon. DeRozan started off the game with great energy, he was D’ing up Richardson, beating him down the floor, helping and recovering against Nash, even had a great sweeping move for two which he followed it up with a jumper. Whatever went wrong for him in LA was going right early, a good comeback performance from the rookie. Turkoglu’s shot was on early and he didn’t show any sign of the hip problem that’s been bothering him, he had 8 in the first quarter. The Raptors shot 58% in the first while the Suns were at 62%, we had kept pace with the Suns’ offense so far and held a 2 point lead, but I also got the feeling we couldn’t sustain this kind of game and needed to slow things down to keep pace. Either our transition defense needed to significantly improve or we’d need to slow the pace down just a tad.
The first quarter point total was 64 but the second quarter only saw 39 points being scored. A big part of the reason was both starting PGs taking a big breather, Nash missed close to half the quarter as Goran Dragic got some run and Triano went with Jack who was once again atrocious. And I mean he was bad. Will Solomon bad. His ridiculously lazy pass got picked off for a steal, he couldn’t facilitate anything on offense and his jumper was clanging rim. The bright spot for the Raptors here was Sonny Weems who got in and looked agile and athletic, he was found by Marco Belinelli for a alley-oop slam that’s sure to be on a few highlight reels. The Italian also stepped in to knock down some solid threes with his mouthguard hanging out, I love his swagger.
Bosh and Bargnani were the well we drank from in the first half and Belinelli and Johnson gave us the lift off the bench. Amir Johnson (9 rebounds) was making Amundson a non-factor and our interior defense in the latter half of the second quarter was downright solid. Johnson deserves a lot of credit for bringing the intensity and effort, something that really wasn’t an issue at all tonight.
As Jack’s struggling to do anything positive, Belinelli’s showing a little more diversity in his game. He took some questionable shots, made some and missed some but I was impressed by his defensive work-rate, it’s consistently effective. He’s not a stopper, not even an above-average defender but the guy does fight on defense which is more than I can say for Jack. I suggest easing back Jack’s minutes and trying Belinelli as a point-forward, it can only be a positive and it’ll send Jack a message that minutes aren’t guaranteed around these parts.
After the Raps got themselves an early 5 point lead, it was Channing Frye time. Up until now Bargnani had gotten the better of him, Frye had knocked down a three in each of the first two quarters but had remained relatively anonymous. He was left wide open for three in the third and he knocked them all down. If you give back on defense what you score on offense, you haven’t had much of a game. Bargnani had 17/4 on 6-15, Frye had 20/7 on 6-9. I think the number’s speak for themselves. It’s hard for me to believe why Bargnani would leave Frye open without reason, if you look at those three plays, there is no reason Frye should be getting those looks. There are no screens set for him, Bargnani doesn’t have urgent help issues, it’s just mind-boggling. I don’t want Frye’s offensive display to take away from some of the good things Bargnani brought to the mix, I thought he created very well (despite having zero assists) by pulling the defense towards him and kicking it out efficiently, his drives on the baseline were solid and his jumper was good enough to keep Phoenix honest. Still, wouldn’t you like to see Bargnani punish the frail looking Frye in the post?
You also have to give Phoenix credit, they are the best at finding the open wing man after even a mild double. It literally takes them a second and a half between attracting a double and finding the shooter, an area the Raptors have to work on. As well as Bosh played last night, he needs to be more aware of where the shooter’s are on the floor. Phoenix was very keen on cheating off our wing men to help on Bosh all night long and we didn’t make them pay enough. This will need to be looked at in the film room and Bosh needs to be made aware of this.
After going scoreless in the second, Turkoglu returned to score 5 in the third and got some help from Bosh and Bargnani as well. Weems got off the bench again to knock down a good-looking pull-up jumper and played sound defense on Richardson who was held to 2-9FG through the first three quarters by the combination of DeRozan, Belinelli and Weems. Nash wasn’t allowed to run rampant and the Raptors defense did a good job of keeping him in front of them by switching taller wings on him, this was the quarter where we defended their high screen the best by providing quick additional help whenever Amare got deep in the post. A two point lead at the end of three, not much to complain about except if we had only contained Frye, we would’ve had a much bigger cushion.
We needed some real leadership and focus at the start of the fourth and didn’t get it. Jack made one good play – a drive and kick to Belinelli for a corner three – but other than that the offense under him was awful as we conceded a 14-2 run. An ill-advised Bosh three, Jack missing a step-back three early in the clock, Dudley blocking Jack on a weak drive, and the killer – a Jack turnover leading to a Richardson fast-break which gave the Suns a 5 point lead. Why Jack was even handling the ball is a mystery since Jose was also on the floor (I’ll resist going into a diatribe about them playing together). Mother momentum had switched sides after that play. I don’t understand why we are so comfortable giving Turkoglu the ball late in the fourth quarter but don’t let him handle it early in the fourth? Is there a difference? I don’t think so.
We also forgot about Chris Bosh for a long stretch after the smaller Dudley was given the assignment, instead of going inside to what worked, we launched jumpers. It’s partially Bosh’s fault for not demanding the ball and fighting for position against a smaller player, but Jack needs to take some heat for not correcting a misguided offense. On the next possession we ran the hi-lo which netted him a foul and he went 1-2FT. In a one point loss you have to point to these sorts of plays. Not the l
After battling back from 5 down thanks to a great Jose Calderon drive and a Bosh score, Frye’s final dagger hit us hard at 2:19. A wide open three after being left open by Bargnani, a defensive error to say the least. Bargnani made amends on the ensuing possession by driving for two but after that the officials, who were really giving Phoenix the benefit of the doubt on charges and personal fouls all night long, handed Stoudemire two FTs. Triano called Turkoglu’s number who hit two long contested jumpers to give the Raptors a 2 point lead with 0:51 left but the lead was short-lived. Nash missed a three and Triano called another iso only to see Turkoglu’s long-range effort rim out. Nash then drove past Calderon for an And1 (there was no foul anywhere in sight) to put Phoenix up one with 12 ticks left.
I thought the final play was going to be a drive and happen early enough so that we’d have a chance to go at the offensive rebound, and maybe that was the intent, but Turkoglu held on to the ball too long, bumbled it and was forced into a shot he’d rather not have taken. Game over.
Liners:
- Anybody wonder where Sonny Weems went in the fourth?
- From chat on Amare: [21:56] birdmanpresents: We know u didnt hurt ur eyes on the court, ur ugly ass just looked in the mirror.
- Bargnani’s fifth foul which sent him to the bench was very stupid. I appreciate the hustle but going after an offensive rebound that you have on chance of getting is not the way to go, especially when you have four fouls.
- Jose Calderon could’ve been more aggressive today, 8/3/7 on 3-7FG with zero turnovers is a clean stat line but there’s no reason he couldn’t have gotten 15+ tonight. Also saw some very conservative play from him today, something which hasn’t been there this season.
- All three of Jarrett Jack’s turnovers were lazy and unprofessional. If this guy’s getting flustered playing in Game 10, how’s he going to hold up if we’re in a playoff race? I’m not going to give up on him, but it’s hard to stay with him.
- Raptors were -7 no the glass but held Phoenix to 44.9% while shooting 45.5%.
- Belinelli missed a clean look at 6:37 which would’ve stopped the bleeding in that 14-2 fourth quarter run.
This was a loss but there were many positives to be taken from it. Rest easy Republic.
71 Raps
I just hope we have something left in the tank for what will arguably be our toughest game of this road trip against Denver. If Wright is good to play, I think he should start alongside Hedo and guard Melo, and try to get him off his game early, no offence to DeRozan.
great as usual brother. I really like Triano but sometimes I feel that he is not able to adapt/react to what is happening in the game. He basically goes in with a certain strategy and sticks to it no matter what
That last shot by Turkoglu brought back so many bad memories. Ever since vince missed that shot during the playoffs, missed buzzer beaters hurt that much more.
Good Game, We deserved the Win. I would have liked to see Bosh with the ball for the final play even though HEDO had the hot hand.
We’ve seen Bosh with the ball for the final play a thousand times…Giving Turk a chance was a nice change even though he missed.
Amare said after the game they were looking for Hedo to take the last shot.
That was the Bosh before he bulked up. Bosh deserved the last play. A high percentage shot is one in the post not a mid-range jumper.
When I try to remember Bosh in clutch situations, I only remember turnovers. Even if the Suns knew Turkoglu was taking the last shot of the game (as did the entire fanbase), I’d still rather him have the iso than Bosh.
+1
You are the only “writer” on here worth reading on a regular basis. Appreciate the game insights. The rest are all argument ad hominem and red herring, not to mention the atrocious grammar and spelling. Can the site make a commitment to tidying up the writing? Mistakes communicate incompetence and distract from the ideas causing them to be devalued.
Jack man.. You’re killing us.. I don’t get Triano’s love fest with “3 people who can handle the ball on the floor at once!!!OMGZOMG!!111eleven” What is he expecting from those guys? There’s only ONE BALL.
He was a point guard himself…so. And the idea is not a bad one if Jack wasn’t the highly questionable third piece. I really get a sense that he’s being given just enough rope to hang himself…and even though they keep going with him, once he plays himself out of the rotation it’s going to be hard for him to get in. Too many good hungry players who can step in their and play the two…
“(I’ll resist going into a diatribe about them playing together)”
please, i wish you would write a little about this.
it just kills me to see jack and calderon on the floor at the same time.
it was precisely this stretch that sunk the raps this game. we have all kinds of spot shooters, jack is not one of them. sigh.
i just hate the fact that we have to endure Triano’s learning curve.
When Bargnani had the 5th foul and went to the bench the Offensive went to under zero. Stagnant.
So far you are always finding problems around Bargnani game. The kid is a stud and deserve more touches.
Cut 10 offensive attempt to Bosh and give them to Bargnani.He is the real deal.
Bosh can look more on defense instead of his max contract.IMO
Agree with Rob – Bargnani on the bench with 5 fouls + Jack on the court allowed the Suns to match-up better and go on a mini-run. Triano had to put AB back in (and the offense improved immediately).
As for the complaints re: Triano’s commitment to switches, suggest a better alternative. If Jose goes under the screen, Nash hits the wide open J. If Jose goes over the top, Nash lobs to Amare all game. They forced more turns from Amare using the switch. Yes, he scored his share, but he’s a terrible passer from the double team.
Finally, remember that Triano is still learning what he has to work with. Expect more of Bellinelli and Wright and less of Jack at the 2 as the season progresses. Add the eventual return of Evans to the mix, and we finally have a decent team to watch.
I didn’t see the game but the +/- stats are in full support of what you said , Andrea +15 , Bosh -12 .
watching is irrelevant, i guess. that’s a 27-pt difference, so it’s pretty clear that bosh is the problem, and bargs the solution. they need to give bargs more minutes, more touches, more looks, more chances! he had 4 less shot attempts than bosh (FOUR!!), and 5 less than hedo (FIVE!!!). if he’d had more touches, he obviously would have shot better. i don’t know why they ignore him so much on offense, he always seems to be open at the 3-pt line trailing the play.
Yeah, because that’s what he said.
He simply provided statistics to support what someone who DID watch the game saw. If stats support observation, the argument tends to be sound.
“if he’d had more touches, he obviously would have shot better.”
We’ve seen many times how Bargs can catch fire if given more shots. Not guaranteed, but possible, and dare I say probable.
There are some things that you can’t immediately tell by watching, like how much Bosh has benefitted from the floor spacing that results from Bargnani’s presence on the floor. Some things you can tell by watching, like Bargnani’s increasing responsibility as the primary man defender on a scoring big. I watched bits of the Clippers game again and saw that Bargnani was chiefly responsible for checking Kaman, while Bosh checked Camby, and I also saw that Kaman was scoring on some very nice fades, despite decent contests by Bargnani.
If the season #s show that Bargnani has a better +/- than Bosh (currently he does and Belinelli is 2nd… small sample size…) then I don’t think that we should conclude that he’s a better player than Bosh, but we may be able to conclude that the Raps are best when he’s on the floor and that some of the perceived deficiencies (rebounding, help D) are being offset by other things that he is doing (scoring, spacing the floor, on-ball D which takes him out of position). You can’t discount the #s.
Most interesting is that the Raps 3 best 5-man units so far are Bosh-Bargnani-Calderon units with either Turk or Belinelli as facilitators.
As I was playing in my regular sunday night basketball league, I also did not see the game except for the last 53 seconds. Anticipating a barrage of bargnani criticisms because we lost I checked the ‘net for the boxscore to find the +15 which was by far the best of anyone who played last nights game on either side!
Turk has a history of making big shots however I just wish they would give bargnani the opportunity to take the game deciding shot – in the few opportunities he has had in his career he made huge end of game shots (think of Portland game as a rookie, Seattle game as a rookie where we made a 4 point play, and the boston game last year where he hit a game tying three in the last few seconds)
The reason that Turk was the right choice here is because not only is he a big game stud, he’s also the second best facilitator on the team. At that point they have a plan ABC. With Bargs you mostly have one shot and that’s it.
If he hadn’t boggled the ball because the pass was a little low, I think he would have had a cleaner look. Would a, could a, should a…I know.
I agree with having the ball in Turks hands as he is the best facilitator, but Bargnani was wide open for a 3 in that last play.
I think Triano’s strategy was sound. The suns “only” scored 101 points and were fortunate to have Frye hit 6 of 8 3-pointers.
With the suns, it really is a case of picking your poison. The raps almost went into Phoenix and beat one of the best and hottest teams in the NBA.
I agree. We held the Suns to 45% shooting. From what I saw (Q1 – Q3) that was primarily due to our strategy on the Nash/Amare P&R and forcing Amare – not NAsh – to facilitate the Suns offence. As you noted, Frye’s shots were the results of lapses within our system. Bargnani failed to execute the defence and that’s primarily on him, not Triano. I think you gotta give the Raps credit overall on this one.
I think Weems looked great. Jack should not play the 2 b/c Belinelli, DeRozan, Wright and Weems can handle those minutes very effectively. Jay needs to force Jack to earn his playing time. That said, I think he’ll be fine…
I don’t understand how Arse can complain about the strategy, which obviously worked wonders.
1-point game against the Suns? What was the over-under on total score for this game? 250? I think a defensive effort like that deserves applause.
And if you’re going to say it was because the pace was slower, so they scored less points, then great! What do you think the Suns want to do? Play at a slow pace? Come on, it was a great success which let us play with one of the league’s early leaders.
Really fun game to watch, the first quarter in particular was great.
Can we not ever play the Calderon/Jack backcourt again? Has that worked all season?
What was in Triano’s mind? The Turk shot works only the in the playoffs. Nice game though and maintain the same effort in Denver.
Damn what a tough loss. A punch right to the gut.
I guess I kinda agree with the moral victory thing though. Despite Jarrett Jack’s best efforts to give the game away in the fourth, we hung tough to the bitter end.
Hopefully we can take one in Denver or Utah (cause I don’t see us winning them both) and come out of this horrific stretch a respectable 6-6.
‘but you also have to consistently provide help on the big once he gets the ball in the post, if you’re late on that it’s suicide’
They’ve been switching constantly since the Chicago game, and although it kept us in the game for stretches because our bigs did a good job on Nash, it also made life very easy for Stoudemire when he got the ball down low on EVERY possesion with Calderon guarding him and the double team coming.
That is exactly the same stratgey Mitchell used as head coach except with the double not coming immediately and employing it with worse players than we currently have.
Some fans seem to suggest that Bargniani should get more touches or ’shouldnt get looked off on pick and rolls’ (he never rolls by the way, only spots up for pick and pop opportunities) but why does he need more touches? He gets plenty. Why doesn’t he grab a few more rebounds and give himself and the team extra possessions as a center. That would give him more offensive opportunities if thats what you’re looking for and closer to the basket where he can utilize his height and maybe draw a few fouls as he is a great free throw shooter but never gets to the line.
He is trying this more. He slipped in for an offensive board last game, and got called for a foul trying it in this one. His rebounding IQ isn’t great.
Actually, he does roll to the basket but almost never gets the pass (Jose always plays it safe). Eventually he stops rolling and pops because he knows that he’ll get the pass there. He needs to recognize that Jack is willing to make the pass towards the hoop whereas Jose isn’t – this lack of recognition caused a turnover yesterday.
When you roll to the basket you also need to be in a position in which you can catch the ball and power up, not just a tribute screen with a polite wave.
He’s a big man and if he sets a hard screen and rolls with purpose he would get the ball afterwards. Bosh does it and gets fed all of the time.
Let’s look hardcore at Mr. Jack. He’s a decent facilitator and a more than competent back up PG. Okay, so far. He drives to the hoop and kicks out well. I like that. He’s strong enough to get to the basket and play through traffic and he’s a decent on the ball defender. Still good…
He’s undoubtedly the worst SG we have, because outside of ten, maybe fifteen feet he can’t shoot. So what exactly is he doing around the perimeter when it’s him and Calderon on the floor? He should be the one with the dribble penetration and then the kick out. What he needs to know is that the reason he’s so open on the three point line is because the scouting report says that he couldn’t hit that shot if his next meal depended on it.
If I was Triano, I would say to him, that he has license to do anything inside of fifteen feet, but if I catch him Jacking a shot from outside of that range again, I’m going to cut off his F*cking thumbs.
I think the real fault here is that Colangelo and Triano have given him the license to play us out of games, because he has been a better scorer in previous years. Okay maybe that Jack is dead, let’s mourn the loss of him and deal realistically with this one.
Oh gawd it better not be Milt Palacio the 2nd, considering how bad his shooting is right now.
Awesome game. I was excited and happy to see this level of effort.
Just another quick little kudo to Belinelli…really good defense on Barbosa. Essentially made a premiere sixth man look average.
With all due respect, Arsenalist I completely disagree with your thoughts on the Amare/Nash swtich. The reason why Phonenix’s system works so well is because the penetration of Nash the ensuing unpredictably which generally leads to wide open three attempts. By switching, Nash did not drive as easily as he usually can (especially against the raptors) and the suns offense became predictable; a definite advantage for the raptors. The Raptors did a great job providng a weakside double on Amare once Nash played the double and the rotations were pretty sound all night. All in all, I think the Raptors played great defense last night. Any time you can keep an 113 offensive rating team to 101 points (not sure where to find the pace of the game) it was a good result.
I think the problem with the strategy was not that switching on the screen, but that we didn’t throw different looks there. Nash knew what was coming, and made adjustments to get Amare the ball every time, and have Amare punish Calderon in the post. If Triano switched it up every so often, we could have kept Nash honest, and maybe throw a kink into the Suns offense.
Just found this site through ESPN… I had no idea that a raptor player had such an extensive blog on the web. I mean, that’s the only way I can explain “we”. What number are you?
Anyway, the strategy was sound, held the Suns to under their season average, and under 45 pct shooting. I think you’ll take being down 1 on the road to the best team in the league with the ball in your hands to win the game any day of the week.
Whatever douche bag! “We” don’t want you on this site. Go back on ESPN with your useless comments. It is obvious that “we” are huge raptors fans and “we” take pride in how “our” team plays.
Haha another Yankee that thinks that Toronto is a snowmobile outpost… How original!
Let’s not be too hard on the Raps, or on any one player, even Jack. The NBA is a vets league. Veteran, experienced teams win even when facing more talented but younger teams.
The Raptors are a remarkably young team. Take Weems for example. Everybody’s talking about playing him more. Maybe Weems is a great player, or maybe he’s a terrible player. We just don’t know. Weems is 23 years old, and his entire career sample size before this year is: last year he played 55 garbage-time minutes with Denver.
Amir Johnson has played some minutes, but is 22. Bosh is 25. Bargnani has really only played starter minutes since Mitchell’s firing last year. And he’s only 24. Calderon is 28 but has only started for 2 years before this one. DDR is a 20 year old rook. Belinelli played hardly at all his rookie year, started 23 games last year but only played 21 minutes per, and is now all of 23 years old. Antoine Wright started 53 games last year but has never played significant minutes, because of his offensive issues, and is now 25.
And so we arrive, as you knew we must, at Jarrett Jack. He’s played starter minutes for 3 years prior to this one, and been average every year. He is 26. Everything that he could be doing positively is down and every negative is up. I don’t know why. I know that he is playing horrible, cover-your-eyes awful shooting guard. I know Triano is gradually cutting back his minutes. I know the Raps have lots of options if he doesn’t work out. He will improve if for no other reason than he simply can’t get much worse. He’s hurting the Raps almost as much as if he put on the opposition’s uni and started playing 6-on-4. In the opener, he played 31 minutes. Last night he played 18. That trend will continue until he improves.
The only regular who’s an experienced, proven winner is Turk. And he’s out of shape.
These guys don’t know how to win NBA games yet. They know how to play ball, but not how to win. Let’s sit back and watch them learn.
If the Raps want to be on “the next level” they have to nail game-stealing buzzer beaters. If they cannot, they will never go anywhere in the future. In 2007, unfortunately it was against the Clippers, TJ Ford nailed the buzzer beater and the Raps started playing like a winning team (despite that the Atlantic Division really sucked).
Agreed, maybe come February start letting Turk take that shot, right now it should be Bosh…
“Still, wouldn’t you like to see Bargnani punish the frail looking Frye in the post?”
Yes I would but in order for that to happen we need a PG who is willing to feed him when he establishes deep post position. How many times this season has he pinned a man down low, demanded the ball, only to be looked off. Sometimes the Raps shot selection really makes me wonder.
‘How many times this season has he pinned a man down low, demanded the ball, only to be looked off’
is it 5?
Bargs almost never pins his man down low, and I don’t recall him doing it last night at all. I will say Bargs is missed on occasion but its almost always at the 3pt line.
Once last night I saw Bargs open on a roll to the net and Calderon didn’t pass it to him…. then I remembered thats the only time Bargs has ever done that… how could Jose expect it.
We’re obviously not watching the same game – Jose almost never feeds Bargs the ball in the post (especially on pick & roll situations). Jose has 2 passes: 1 – Bosh in the post (and rarely on a pick & roll) 2 – swing to open perimeter player.
I’m glad at least someone is watching the games.
i’m not sure what you’re getting at. i re-watched the game when i got home today, specifically focusing on bargs, looking for these mysterious & frequent ‘pin-downs’ in which he’s looked off. i saw it happen once, where he went into the post with the intention of establishing dominant position, obtained said position, was in a position to receive a pass, but did not. for most of the game, he floats on the perimeter. that’s just the way it was. i guess we just ’see’ things differently.
on another, but somewhat related, note…just how fucking irritating would it be to play with him? think about that, and maybe it’ll start to click as to why he gets looked-off. i know these guys are pros, and we’d like to think that they’re ‘above that,’ but at the end of the day, it’s a game in which success is predicated on team play. to me, bargs isn’t a team player…he doesn’t do the ‘little’ things that tell his teammates that he’s willing to go to battle with them. whether that impacts his touches or not is unknown…but i know for damn sure i wouldn’t look to just give it up to him when i have other teammates who are out there killing themselves all over the court. it’s called rewarding hard work, and unfortunately, since the day he was drafted, he’s been annointed as someone ’special,’ as a guy who’s above the hard work that defines the careers of the greats of the game. some may marvel at how he’s improved under triano, but i still see the same things out of him that got him nailed to the bench…’cept now, BC’s got a little lap dog who he can control & keep bargs’ minutes up.
yeah yeah, i’m a hater. let me know when he’s a key piece of a 50-win team.
-Jose almost never feeds Bargs the ball in the post-
Its because Bargs is almost never in the post and almost never rolls. Doing it once or twice a game doesnt lead to a pg expecting a player to do that.
Bargs is a sit a the perimeter, pick-and-pop player. Im not knocking him for it… thats where his strengths lie (a great shooter and can beat most other bigs off the dribble). But to think he is down low or cutting to the basket with any sort of regularity is a stretch.
Good points Hardcore Raps … so let’s call it what it is … Bosh is now the overachieving center … and Bargs is the PF who occasionally gets under the basket to hopefully block out and even snag a rebound or two. Perhaps we should even go so far as to define Bargs as the SF … and Hedo the PG/SG … while Jose and Jack are fill-in players like Derozan …!!!!
The Raps are a real mixed bag of disparate players attempting to create a functional team. I wonder if time will catch up to them as the opposition teams figure out how to exploit this all offense/no defense “team”…..
I recall a play after a timeout where four Raps stood outside the arc with only Bosh near the basket … the ball came to him and he easily dropped it in … all because the defense was momentarily spread out. Maybe the Raps should use the “outside-the-arc” offensive set hoping to spread the floor thus allowing Bosh to play one-on-one with his defender … ya think …?????
Amir Johnson was my closet MVP of the game…It was him that turned Amundson into a non-factor and stole the ball out of Dudley’s hands late in the game, we won the garbage wars, and Hump is almost forgotten like a fart in the open air.
Arse … again you can’t see the obvious .. you can’t see the forest for the trees …!!!!!!!
What we witnessed was two all offense/no defense teams duking it out last night in PHX … plain and simple.
The Sun’s shooting tanked for a while and the Raps shooting held up … until the Sun’s made a good run in the fourth and the Raps almost caught up.
Sooooo obvious …..!!!!!!
I thought we actually saw this team play some perimeter D(for the first time this year). The Suns have buried every team from beyond the ark this year, except for us. If it wasn’t for Chandler being obscenely hot, we win this. If it wasn’t for the refs changing their glasses when the Raps had the ball, we win this. Jack doesn’t play we win this.
We lead this game almost from the beginning to the end, against arguably the hottest team in the league right now…in their building.
The only thing that is…Soooo obvious to me, is that you are pathologically incapable of giving the Raps any credit whatsoever.
And if you didn’t over simplify your points and sound so patronizing with your style, you might get taken a little more seriously.
Gman says: “Jack doesn’t play we win this.
The only thing that is…Soooo obvious to me, is that you are pathologically incapable of giving the Raps any credit whatsoever.
And if you didn’t over simplify your points and sound so patronizing with your style, you might get taken a little more seriously.”
…………………..
Geeez Gman … You make a “simplified” one-liner blurting “point” … and then you accuse others of being “pathologically incapable”…??!!! Sounds like you have self-diagnosed yourself “perfectly” … LOL
Down the road, we might look back to the second half against the Clippers as a turning point for this team. Something carried over into this one against the Suns. They’ve grown since last week. Hope it continues (knock wood).
Triano may have made a few individual strategy errors (that have been pointed out) but big-picture, there’s a sense of team play throughout that is looking more and more promising. As well, the bench is being used in smarter ways every game. I think JT is going a ways to proving (even more) that Colangelo SERIOUSLY knows what he’s doing. In time, Triano might prove to be the best coach the Raptors have had yet. I can see it.
I’d like to see what would happen if Bargs was given a specific offensive PLAN for every first quarter. Like (for instance), upon finding the ball in his hands inside the arc (and maybe outside, depending on spacing) every other time (or so) immediately fake one way and go the other, as straight to the hole as he can, WITHOUT hesitating. As it is, he often dithers … and when he dithers, his confidence may drop (or not) a percentage point or two … but regardless, the defense (obviously) has that moment to get better prepared for whatever is coming. (He needs to be given instruction on EXACTLY what to do early on, as I see it. In other words, keep him from thinking too much.) And he’s quick enough to be able to pull it off, easy. I think the affects this would have would be all for the good. And later on, of course, when he wants to bomb away from outside the arc, he’d likely have that extra bit of spacing that wouldn’t hurt.
Also, someone needs to mention to him that he’s line-driving his shots of late. (I’m sure someone has.)
Go Raps!
The thing I am noticing more is how our bench rotations are shaping up in this DEATH 8 span. Belli is starting to heat, Amir Johnson “gets it”, Wright is starting to notice what NOT to do (I hope) on offense, and Weems is being neglected like Cinderella (the alley-oop in PHX was his trip to the ball in the Pumpkin) by the ugly stepmother bitch (Triano’s stupid side).
I’m liking Belinelli, I’m really liking Johnson, I want to see Wright back doing more of the D thing (and not-so-much of the 3-shots-in-a-row thing) and I’m hoping we get to see more of what Weems can do. To me, Weems looked like he belonged out there; smooth and athletic as they come. All bodes well.
It seems to me that right now Weems has more confidence, talent and athleticism than Derozan.
Those three years that Sonny Weems (23 yrs old) has on DeMar might show in short bursts … but we’d probably have to see him in longer stretches to really know what we have here with him. Reading about his high school and college years (wikipedia), it sounds like he’s a player who can get it done, for sure. But I like DeMar a lot, too. Like I say, bodes well.
“and it’ll send Jack a message that minutes aren’t guaranteed around these parts.”
I dont believe Jack is playing the way he is because he is disinterested or tired or a general malingering douche. There is definitely a problem no doubt because he is playing nothing like what I remember him either from his Portland or Indiana stints. This was a player Bird made a trade for and one who gave TJ Ford competitive fits with the Pacers. Indy was loathe to lose him to the Raps and not keeping him was a financial descision. So what are we to make of his play? I dont know…he is even losing his swagger…he cant revv up the troops nor be in a teaching mode with some of the “lessers” because of the way he is playing himself. We may have won that game if he had been more productive last night. Damn.
I stopped reading after you bailed out Calderon and described JJ’s game as ‘attrocious’. I agree with the flaws in the defensive system used last night, and despite how good Nash is, Jose proved once again he is THE worst starting PG in the league defensively.
Sorry to sound harsh, but i would love it if anyone proved me wrong in that regard.
Ps, we win last night’s game had Calderon and JJ’s minutes been reversed.
Jose played solid defense against Nash last night. In fact… Calderon spent most of the night covering Amare because of the switches.
Watch the game not the box score.
I watched every second of the game. The main reason Triano applied that defensive scheme last night is because of Jose’s inability to fight off screens. Sure we want to limit their damage from the perimeter, but Jose’s defense is bad to the point that JT needs to incorporate it in our strategy.
Btw, did you see Jose’s punani ass foul on the winning point of the game?
He was horrible defensively all game (system aside).
People really need to get over their ideals of Jose from last year and watch him on D with an open mind. Just when I thought some haters were opening their eyes… ‘Raps lost so it must be Jose’s fault’ comes out again. There is a big difference between not being good and being “the worst”.
Nash did almost all his damage while Jose was NOT covering him (ie on switches). Watching the game again and take off the “I hate Jose” glasses you have on.
Agreed, these are the same folks who wanted to have Jack start instead of Jose about a week and a half ago. Its easier to rely on old prejudices than actually watch a game with a open mind.
if you watched ‘every second,’ then you should realize how silly it is to assume that had JJ been given jose’s minutes, the outcome would have been in the raps favour. the way JJ was going, i’m thinking it wouldn’t have been within 10 pts. and no, i’m not implying the raps would’ve won.
In the 3rd Quarter start Calderon actually outmatched Amare twice (not physically) by poking the ball out of his hands twice.
You mean he actually played good defense on 2 possessions? Nice, that’s what 8M$ should buy you!
You don’t need to force a turnover or even prevent a bucket to play good defense.
Fair enough. We’ll check on Jose’s progress defensively half way through the season. I’ll be the first to stand up and tip my hat if he decides to man up and play with more grit defensively. But his defense since he’s been in the league has been brutal, and this year it’s actually worse than last year.
I constantly picked on Bosh for not playing with the grit and agression required to be a true leader, and i’ll be first to admit that he’s been more than impressive this year.
There’s nothing wrong with describing the flaws in our team and its players.
And speaking of goggles, many of you need to remove your purple coloured goggles. Jose is signed for a few more years, he’s got to show progression in the areas he lacks consistancy…there’s just no excuse otherwise.