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	<title>Comments on: Morning Linkage &#8211; Oct. 20/09</title>
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	<link>http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/10/20/morning-linkage-oct-2009/</link>
	<description>The Penultimate Toronto Raptors Fan Website</description>
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		<title>By: Bob</title>
		<link>http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/10/20/morning-linkage-oct-2009/#comment-42516</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Oct 2009 11:25:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=11603#comment-42516</guid>
		<description>Bosh is good for 20 points and 10 rebs. Will Bargs ever provide that? I want to think he can but I seriously doubt it. Its that simple.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bosh is good for 20 points and 10 rebs. Will Bargs ever provide that? I want to think he can but I seriously doubt it. Its that simple.</p>
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		<title>By: J</title>
		<link>http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/10/20/morning-linkage-oct-2009/#comment-42509</link>
		<dc:creator>J</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Oct 2009 05:41:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=11603#comment-42509</guid>
		<description>Just a tiny correction: it&#039;ll be ~$25 mil in year 6 if he resigns with the Raptors or is flipped in a sign and trade, or just a tad under $22 mil in year 5 (and thus, likely ~$23 mil in year 6 assuming basketball revenue doesn&#039;t skyrocket) if he signs with a different team.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just a tiny correction: it&#8217;ll be ~$25 mil in year 6 if he resigns with the Raptors or is flipped in a sign and trade, or just a tad under $22 mil in year 5 (and thus, likely ~$23 mil in year 6 assuming basketball revenue doesn&#8217;t skyrocket) if he signs with a different team.</p>
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		<title>By: RapthoseLeafs</title>
		<link>http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/10/20/morning-linkage-oct-2009/#comment-42505</link>
		<dc:creator>RapthoseLeafs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Oct 2009 04:16:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=11603#comment-42505</guid>
		<description>As I see that poll, and to which some people have alluded to, Bosh seems to be at, or close to his ceiling. Andrea may never get to the level we envision a No. 1 draft pick - however that simple statement implicitedly means ... he has a higher ceiling, or at least we believe the ceiling is still enough above him. Of course, the exception to this way of thinking would be Khandor. 

Semantics or not, I still believe Bargnani represents a greater potential then what we see now. Bosh, I see only a marginal difference. Of course any team would choose the latter - at this point in time. But change the scenario to a Bosh making 27 million in year 6 (as I understand), and I bet GM&#039;s would have good reason to pause. That kind of contract can be an albatross. Case in point - JO. 

As I&#039;ve reiterated on a number of occasions, Basketball is not only a game of talent, but of financial accounting. And a bit magician work. Several months ago, the Raptors appeared to have a set of financial handcuffs on. Then BC performed a little magical work, and quickly enough, optimism arrived and our Bench seemed to strengthen. 

As much as I&#039;d like to see Bosh stay a Raptor, I&#039;m afraid his &quot;I deserve Max like Lebron&quot; persona might come back to haunt us. And I think that might be how BC sees the Big Picture as well.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As I see that poll, and to which some people have alluded to, Bosh seems to be at, or close to his ceiling. Andrea may never get to the level we envision a No. 1 draft pick &#8211; however that simple statement implicitedly means &#8230; he has a higher ceiling, or at least we believe the ceiling is still enough above him. Of course, the exception to this way of thinking would be Khandor. </p>
<p>Semantics or not, I still believe Bargnani represents a greater potential then what we see now. Bosh, I see only a marginal difference. Of course any team would choose the latter &#8211; at this point in time. But change the scenario to a Bosh making 27 million in year 6 (as I understand), and I bet GM&#8217;s would have good reason to pause. That kind of contract can be an albatross. Case in point &#8211; JO. </p>
<p>As I&#8217;ve reiterated on a number of occasions, Basketball is not only a game of talent, but of financial accounting. And a bit magician work. Several months ago, the Raptors appeared to have a set of financial handcuffs on. Then BC performed a little magical work, and quickly enough, optimism arrived and our Bench seemed to strengthen. </p>
<p>As much as I&#8217;d like to see Bosh stay a Raptor, I&#8217;m afraid his &#8220;I deserve Max like Lebron&#8221; persona might come back to haunt us. And I think that might be how BC sees the Big Picture as well.</p>
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		<title>By: brothersteve</title>
		<link>http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/10/20/morning-linkage-oct-2009/#comment-42503</link>
		<dc:creator>brothersteve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Oct 2009 02:45:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=11603#comment-42503</guid>
		<description>Explanation is simple.

It looks like Bosh has reached his ceiling.

Bargs still is getting better each year and his ceiling isn&#039;t defined yet.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Explanation is simple.</p>
<p>It looks like Bosh has reached his ceiling.</p>
<p>Bargs still is getting better each year and his ceiling isn&#8217;t defined yet.</p>
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		<title>By: LC009</title>
		<link>http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/10/20/morning-linkage-oct-2009/#comment-42502</link>
		<dc:creator>LC009</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Oct 2009 02:38:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=11603#comment-42502</guid>
		<description>There are several issues at work here that seem to be causing anger and confusion:

1) The question is horrendously subjective in terms of defining what their ceilings are.
2) The question is open to misinterpretation of what is being asked (i.e., some people may read it as &quot;who will have the best career?&quot;).
3) If Bosh plays for 15 years and is great for the vast majority of them, while Bargnani is mediocre for 12 years and amazing for 1 year, then Bargnani&#039;s ceiling is higher.

That last point seems to be hard for some people to grasp. A player&#039;s ceiling is his PEEK. If for even one season Bargnani is better than Bosh ever was, than he has a higher ceiling.

Keep in mind that some players take MUCH longer to develop. Steve Nash took 5 years to basically be Jose Calderon, and 9 years (and a move to Phoenix) to become the MVP level Nash we know and love.

Bargnani COULD be Nowitzki good. The likelihood of that happening is debatable, but to say it is impossible is just silly.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are several issues at work here that seem to be causing anger and confusion:</p>
<p>1) The question is horrendously subjective in terms of defining what their ceilings are.<br />
2) The question is open to misinterpretation of what is being asked (i.e., some people may read it as &#8220;who will have the best career?&#8221;).<br />
3) If Bosh plays for 15 years and is great for the vast majority of them, while Bargnani is mediocre for 12 years and amazing for 1 year, then Bargnani&#8217;s ceiling is higher.</p>
<p>That last point seems to be hard for some people to grasp. A player&#8217;s ceiling is his PEEK. If for even one season Bargnani is better than Bosh ever was, than he has a higher ceiling.</p>
<p>Keep in mind that some players take MUCH longer to develop. Steve Nash took 5 years to basically be Jose Calderon, and 9 years (and a move to Phoenix) to become the MVP level Nash we know and love.</p>
<p>Bargnani COULD be Nowitzki good. The likelihood of that happening is debatable, but to say it is impossible is just silly.</p>
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		<title>By: nadir</title>
		<link>http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/10/20/morning-linkage-oct-2009/#comment-42499</link>
		<dc:creator>nadir</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Oct 2009 02:00:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=11603#comment-42499</guid>
		<description>Embarrassing is what it is. And are these the same people who are reading this site?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Embarrassing is what it is. And are these the same people who are reading this site?</p>
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		<title>By: Raptor Cowboy</title>
		<link>http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/10/20/morning-linkage-oct-2009/#comment-42490</link>
		<dc:creator>Raptor Cowboy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Oct 2009 01:04:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=11603#comment-42490</guid>
		<description>&quot;Bargs ceiling isn&#039;t even at Nowitzki&#039;s level.&quot; 

Please do not tell me that you think that somehow Bosh is better or has a higher ceiling than Nowitzki - 8 time All-Star, 9 time All-NBA, and MVP... 

Ridiculous.

And while we&#039;re on the topic, the question as presented was who has the higher ceiling. Whether or not either of them ever reaches their respective ceiling is a whole other question. And not the one being asked.

A 7&#039; PF/C, with good handles/passing and a great shooting touch is going to have a higher ceiling than a 6&#039;10 PF with only a mid-range to high-post face up game.

If the question was, which player is better now. Or even which player will be the better player over the next couple years, I&#039;d give it to Bosh. However, in six years, Bosh has yet to develop a meaningful post game and his passing out of doubles hasn&#039;t improved either... I&#039;ll take a pass on his three point shooting.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Bargs ceiling isn&#8217;t even at Nowitzki&#8217;s level.&#8221; </p>
<p>Please do not tell me that you think that somehow Bosh is better or has a higher ceiling than Nowitzki &#8211; 8 time All-Star, 9 time All-NBA, and MVP&#8230; </p>
<p>Ridiculous.</p>
<p>And while we&#8217;re on the topic, the question as presented was who has the higher ceiling. Whether or not either of them ever reaches their respective ceiling is a whole other question. And not the one being asked.</p>
<p>A 7&#8242; PF/C, with good handles/passing and a great shooting touch is going to have a higher ceiling than a 6&#8242;10 PF with only a mid-range to high-post face up game.</p>
<p>If the question was, which player is better now. Or even which player will be the better player over the next couple years, I&#8217;d give it to Bosh. However, in six years, Bosh has yet to develop a meaningful post game and his passing out of doubles hasn&#8217;t improved either&#8230; I&#8217;ll take a pass on his three point shooting.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave</title>
		<link>http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/10/20/morning-linkage-oct-2009/#comment-42487</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Oct 2009 23:39:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=11603#comment-42487</guid>
		<description>175 votes in on the poll now and Bargnani has 72% of the vote.

I can&#039;t wrap my head around that. Wow!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>175 votes in on the poll now and Bargnani has 72% of the vote.</p>
<p>I can&#8217;t wrap my head around that. Wow!</p>
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		<title>By: Bob</title>
		<link>http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/10/20/morning-linkage-oct-2009/#comment-42485</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Oct 2009 22:10:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=11603#comment-42485</guid>
		<description>I agree. Bargs ceiling isn&#039;t even at Nowitzki&#039;s level. We&#039;d be VERY fortunate if ever did reach that level though. So for me its a simple vote. Bosh.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree. Bargs ceiling isn&#8217;t even at Nowitzki&#8217;s level. We&#8217;d be VERY fortunate if ever did reach that level though. So for me its a simple vote. Bosh.</p>
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		<title>By: cloako</title>
		<link>http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/10/20/morning-linkage-oct-2009/#comment-42484</link>
		<dc:creator>cloako</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Oct 2009 21:39:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=11603#comment-42484</guid>
		<description>Wow! I just voted on the poll asking who has a higher ceiling, Bosh or Bargs. So far Bargs is ahead. That is insane! Even if Bosh never plays another game, he is already a four time allstar, been on the all NBA second team, and won an Olympic gold metal. Bargs would be lucky to reach any of those goals. I love Bargs, he is one of my favorite players in the league, but this Bosh hatred is getting out of hand. If Bosh has already reached his maximum potential, it&#039;s still top 15 in the league over a 6-8 year stretch. Bargs will never be that.
This poll better be about the roofs in their condos, or I am pissed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow! I just voted on the poll asking who has a higher ceiling, Bosh or Bargs. So far Bargs is ahead. That is insane! Even if Bosh never plays another game, he is already a four time allstar, been on the all NBA second team, and won an Olympic gold metal. Bargs would be lucky to reach any of those goals. I love Bargs, he is one of my favorite players in the league, but this Bosh hatred is getting out of hand. If Bosh has already reached his maximum potential, it&#8217;s still top 15 in the league over a 6-8 year stretch. Bargs will never be that.<br />
This poll better be about the roofs in their condos, or I am pissed.</p>
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		<title>By: Raptoronto</title>
		<link>http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/10/20/morning-linkage-oct-2009/#comment-42477</link>
		<dc:creator>Raptoronto</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Oct 2009 20:07:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=11603#comment-42477</guid>
		<description>&quot;Sometimes, but it&#039;s all about competing,&quot; Bosh said about having everyone at top speed all the time. &quot;If you&#039;re a competitor, we have a lot of competition drills and I don&#039;t want to hear anybody&#039;s mouth in the locker room after so I&#039;m going to make sure I do my best to win every game.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Sometimes, but it&#8217;s all about competing,&#8221; Bosh said about having everyone at top speed all the time. &#8220;If you&#8217;re a competitor, we have a lot of competition drills and I don&#8217;t want to hear anybody&#8217;s mouth in the locker room after so I&#8217;m going to make sure I do my best to win every game.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Butter</title>
		<link>http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/10/20/morning-linkage-oct-2009/#comment-42465</link>
		<dc:creator>Butter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Oct 2009 18:12:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=11603#comment-42465</guid>
		<description>Jose&#039;s toughness has improved over the years as he&#039;s gained confidence. I don&#039;t think a little trash talk will do anything but help him focus. 

Side note: You can win a pair of courtside tickets to see the Raps against the Pistons on Nov. 4 at TOROmagazine.com. Just have to sign up for a weekly newsletter. Here&#039;s the link: 

http://www.toromagazine.com/?q=node/79</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jose&#8217;s toughness has improved over the years as he&#8217;s gained confidence. I don&#8217;t think a little trash talk will do anything but help him focus. </p>
<p>Side note: You can win a pair of courtside tickets to see the Raps against the Pistons on Nov. 4 at TOROmagazine.com. Just have to sign up for a weekly newsletter. Here&#8217;s the link: </p>
<p><a href="http://www.toromagazine.com/?q=node/79" rel="nofollow">http://www.toromagazine.com/?q=node/79</a></p>
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		<title>By: nadir</title>
		<link>http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/10/20/morning-linkage-oct-2009/#comment-42463</link>
		<dc:creator>nadir</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Oct 2009 17:50:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=11603#comment-42463</guid>
		<description>This team will have no trouble scoring, so it would appear the coach is taking the correct approach. Indeed, a good starting point, let&#039;s see if we have any hope of stopping them. And if I see like last season, the ball keep coming out to the other team like for 4 tries like last season, well, that be like zero progress. And on that note, preseason w-l is irrelevant, get over it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This team will have no trouble scoring, so it would appear the coach is taking the correct approach. Indeed, a good starting point, let&#8217;s see if we have any hope of stopping them. And if I see like last season, the ball keep coming out to the other team like for 4 tries like last season, well, that be like zero progress. And on that note, preseason w-l is irrelevant, get over it.</p>
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		<title>By: Raptoronto</title>
		<link>http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/10/20/morning-linkage-oct-2009/#comment-42460</link>
		<dc:creator>Raptoronto</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Oct 2009 17:27:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=11603#comment-42460</guid>
		<description>I agree 100%.  When scrubs talk trash the legit players will pay harder to take it to them; regardless if it&#039;s practice or in a real game.  Intensity and focus seems to have been a problem for this team so it&#039;s a necessary evil

...and at the end of the day these guys know Wright is right; if they are all that then they shouldn&#039;t be letting him get the better of them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree 100%.  When scrubs talk trash the legit players will pay harder to take it to them; regardless if it&#8217;s practice or in a real game.  Intensity and focus seems to have been a problem for this team so it&#8217;s a necessary evil</p>
<p>&#8230;and at the end of the day these guys know Wright is right; if they are all that then they shouldn&#8217;t be letting him get the better of them.</p>
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		<title>By: Malefax</title>
		<link>http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/10/20/morning-linkage-oct-2009/#comment-42454</link>
		<dc:creator>Malefax</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Oct 2009 16:09:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=11603#comment-42454</guid>
		<description>A cool aside: http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=3630 has preseason stats. What sticks out at me for the raptors? The player with the biggest on-court impact for the raptors -- i.e. biggest difference between how many points raptors scored (offensive rating)and how many they gave up (defensive rating) when he was on the floor? Jose Calderon. As far as I can tell from the stats, the Raptors offense totally didn&#039;t function when he wasn&#039;t on the floor.  WHo&#039;d have thought?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A cool aside: <a href="http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=3630" rel="nofollow">http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=3630</a> has preseason stats. What sticks out at me for the raptors? The player with the biggest on-court impact for the raptors &#8212; i.e. biggest difference between how many points raptors scored (offensive rating)and how many they gave up (defensive rating) when he was on the floor? Jose Calderon. As far as I can tell from the stats, the Raptors offense totally didn&#8217;t function when he wasn&#8217;t on the floor.  WHo&#8217;d have thought?</p>
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		<title>By: Raps Fan</title>
		<link>http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/10/20/morning-linkage-oct-2009/#comment-42452</link>
		<dc:creator>Raps Fan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Oct 2009 15:48:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=11603#comment-42452</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s tough, but it is what winners do. I appreciate fierce guys like that. Sure Calderon gets picked on, but it will only help him improve.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s tough, but it is what winners do. I appreciate fierce guys like that. Sure Calderon gets picked on, but it will only help him improve.</p>
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		<title>By: brothersteve</title>
		<link>http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/10/20/morning-linkage-oct-2009/#comment-42449</link>
		<dc:creator>brothersteve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Oct 2009 14:56:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=11603#comment-42449</guid>
		<description>It was good to hear Wright&#039;s comments yesterday.

The team needed someone to come in and talk trash and hopefully be willing to give a hard foul to send a message.

It&#039;s not that you&#039;d want a whole team doing that, but it&#039;s not good if nobody will do it either.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It was good to hear Wright&#8217;s comments yesterday.</p>
<p>The team needed someone to come in and talk trash and hopefully be willing to give a hard foul to send a message.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s not that you&#8217;d want a whole team doing that, but it&#8217;s not good if nobody will do it either.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/10/20/morning-linkage-oct-2009/#comment-42447</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Oct 2009 13:57:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=11603#comment-42447</guid>
		<description>I generally want to throw up when I see most of the guys in the NBA run their mouths like 7 year olds.  But the Raps need some swagger badly and if Wright thinks a little friendly barbing will get under a few guys skin and make them compete a bit harder I&#039;m all for it.  It&#039;s not about being liked.  I loved the quote from Chauncey Billups when he met his new team in Denver.  He said something like &quot;I&#039;m not here to make friends, I&#039;m here to win basketball games&quot;  That is tough....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I generally want to throw up when I see most of the guys in the NBA run their mouths like 7 year olds.  But the Raps need some swagger badly and if Wright thinks a little friendly barbing will get under a few guys skin and make them compete a bit harder I&#8217;m all for it.  It&#8217;s not about being liked.  I loved the quote from Chauncey Billups when he met his new team in Denver.  He said something like &#8220;I&#8217;m not here to make friends, I&#8217;m here to win basketball games&#8221;  That is tough&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: JYD18</title>
		<link>http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/10/20/morning-linkage-oct-2009/#comment-42443</link>
		<dc:creator>JYD18</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Oct 2009 13:34:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=11603#comment-42443</guid>
		<description>Don&#039;t know how I feel about Wright trash talking in practice.  Especially against Jose.  He seems to be a target for the gangster NBA players.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Don&#8217;t know how I feel about Wright trash talking in practice.  Especially against Jose.  He seems to be a target for the gangster NBA players.</p>
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