Comments on: Liston: 45 wins won’t be a layup http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/ The Penultimate Toronto Raptors Fan Website Thu, 18 Mar 2010 04:34:02 -0400 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6 hourly 1 By: In which I worry bout Hedo and a slow start – Season warmup, part 1 « Raptors Report http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-42602 In which I worry bout Hedo and a slow start – Season warmup, part 1 « Raptors Report Thu, 22 Oct 2009 04:20:12 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-42602 [...] is the point where if I were Malcolm Gladwell or Liston I’d pull out some number that shows things aren’t that bad. But I’m neither one and I have no [...] [...] is the point where if I were Malcolm Gladwell or Liston I’d pull out some number that shows things aren’t that bad. But I’m neither one and I have no [...]

]]> By: Tyler Spellen http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40419 Tyler Spellen Sun, 27 Sep 2009 02:03:32 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40419 The reason why Bargs got that contract is because if Bosh leaves, then he can be slid into the PF position, playing his natural position. If he could then be complimented with a Kendrick Perkins/Samual Dalmbert type center, then the raps could have a real chemistry with bigs. The reason why Bargs got that contract is because if Bosh leaves, then he can be slid into the PF position, playing his natural position. If he could then be complimented with a Kendrick Perkins/Samual Dalmbert type center, then the raps could have a real chemistry with bigs.

]]> By: trizzo http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40314 trizzo Thu, 24 Sep 2009 23:15:50 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40314 I meant his contract maxes out to 12 million, obviously he does not have a max contract. 12 million is a lot of money for a player that has not even shown that he can function in the play-offs, much less get his team there. He has not shown any leadership on this team or the NT team, where the opposition is 2nd and 3rd tier. I don't understand how Bryan can be so careless with the money. You can like your pick, but comon'n we can't be playing favorites like that. I meant his contract maxes out to 12 million, obviously he does not have a max contract.

12 million is a lot of money for a player that has not even shown that he can function in the play-offs, much less get his team there.

He has not shown any leadership on this team or the NT team, where the opposition is 2nd and 3rd tier. I don’t understand how Bryan can be so careless with the money. You can like your pick, but comon’n we can’t be playing favorites like that.

]]> By: Seeten http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40305 Seeten Thu, 24 Sep 2009 19:55:24 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40305 I agree with Dan, Bargnani is a pretty quick C, with an excellent first step, its how he gets both his game off on drives, and blocks on 1 on 1 defense. I agree with Dan, Bargnani is a pretty quick C, with an excellent first step, its how he gets both his game off on drives, and blocks on 1 on 1 defense.

]]> By: Alex http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40277 Alex Thu, 24 Sep 2009 13:47:26 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40277 In reality 15 pounds of muscle since the season ended for someone as skinny as bosh is entirely possible. When I was 18, I went from 170 pounds to 190 pounds with my body fat going up 1 percent in a 8 week period.I've never been able to put on muscle that rapidly sone but then I've never been 170 again. In reality 15 pounds of muscle since the season ended for someone as skinny as bosh is entirely possible. When I was 18, I went from 170 pounds to 190 pounds with my body fat going up 1 percent in a 8 week period.I’ve never been able to put on muscle that rapidly sone but then I’ve never been 170 again.

]]> By: Alex http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40276 Alex Thu, 24 Sep 2009 13:46:32 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40276 In reality 15 punds of muscle sine the season ended for someone as skinny as bosh is entirely possible. When I was 18, I went from 170 pounds to 190 pounds with my body fat going up 1 percent in a 8 week period.I've never been able to put on muscle that rapidly sone but then I've never been 170 again. In reality 15 punds of muscle sine the season ended for someone as skinny as bosh is entirely possible. When I was 18, I went from 170 pounds to 190 pounds with my body fat going up 1 percent in a 8 week period.I’ve never been able to put on muscle that rapidly sone but then I’ve never been 170 again.

]]> By: Marz http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40275 Marz Thu, 24 Sep 2009 13:36:35 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40275 I think the reason Bosh looked to gain weight this offseason is to be able to bang in the post more often. If he gained most of the muscle in his core, that will give him a lot more body control when trying to get shots off in traffic. He already has the soft touch around the basket, the added muscle will just keep him from getting knocked around as hard. I think the reason Bosh looked to gain weight this offseason is to be able to bang in the post more often. If he gained most of the muscle in his core, that will give him a lot more body control when trying to get shots off in traffic. He already has the soft touch around the basket, the added muscle will just keep him from getting knocked around as hard.

]]> By: Marz http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40274 Marz Thu, 24 Sep 2009 13:34:38 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40274 I'm not sure where FAQ got that 1lb per week requires roids. As Simon said, it's attainable. And assuming Bosh had a "growth spurt" during the offseason because his body needed to adapt to all the lifting he was doing, the sustainability isn't that far off either. If he continued working out past this offseason, I doubt he'd gain another pound of muscle per week - he's likely hit his ceiling by now for a while. With that being said, I'm not quite sure how they measured the "15 pounds of muscle". Did Bosh gain 15 pounds while staying at the same body fat %? Doubtful. Usually to gain muscle mass you'll also put on some body fat (thanks to the large calorie intake), and then burn it off in the final weeks of your training to get that "ripped physique" look. I’m not sure where FAQ got that 1lb per week requires roids. As Simon said, it’s attainable. And assuming Bosh had a “growth spurt” during the offseason because his body needed to adapt to all the lifting he was doing, the sustainability isn’t that far off either. If he continued working out past this offseason, I doubt he’d gain another pound of muscle per week – he’s likely hit his ceiling by now for a while.

With that being said, I’m not quite sure how they measured the “15 pounds of muscle”. Did Bosh gain 15 pounds while staying at the same body fat %? Doubtful. Usually to gain muscle mass you’ll also put on some body fat (thanks to the large calorie intake), and then burn it off in the final weeks of your training to get that “ripped physique” look.

]]> By: Random Pseudonym http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40265 Random Pseudonym Thu, 24 Sep 2009 12:17:28 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40265 hahah hahah

]]> By: DanH http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40261 DanH Thu, 24 Sep 2009 11:52:51 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40261 Heard it here first huh? The number 10000 >>>> the number 1. You heard it here first. Even though its obvious, common sense, and common knowledge. Heard it here first huh?

The number 10000 >>>> the number 1. You heard it here first. Even though its obvious, common sense, and common knowledge.

]]> By: DanH http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40260 DanH Thu, 24 Sep 2009 11:50:00 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40260 Max contract? He has a contract significantly smaller than a max contract, for a player his age. His contract would have started closer to 12 million and gone up from there, not ended at that value, had it been a max contract. As for motivation, how well did making Bargs earn his court time work with Mitchell? Seems to me it was only when JO went down and he was handed starter's minutes that he performed well. So perhaps in Bargs' case you have this backwards? Max contract? He has a contract significantly smaller than a max contract, for a player his age. His contract would have started closer to 12 million and gone up from there, not ended at that value, had it been a max contract.

As for motivation, how well did making Bargs earn his court time work with Mitchell? Seems to me it was only when JO went down and he was handed starter’s minutes that he performed well. So perhaps in Bargs’ case you have this backwards?

]]> By: Sam http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40259 Sam Thu, 24 Sep 2009 11:38:26 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40259 So the stats at Basketball Reference seem to like the Raptors. According to one analysis they'll finish 4th based on last year's stats. Some reason for optimism beyond fantazy (you spell it with an "s" FAQ) Also, for those looking to waste time without getting into a cat fight with FAQ (or is that FAZ?), I highly recommend Queen City Hoops swap machine thingy. I've switched Andrea Bargnani with just about every big man I can think of. BC should trade him for Okafor by the looks of things. Surprisingly, trading him for Kaman comes out as a bad move. So the stats at Basketball Reference seem to like the Raptors. According to one analysis they’ll finish 4th based on last year’s stats. Some reason for optimism beyond fantazy (you spell it with an “s” FAQ)

Also, for those looking to waste time without getting into a cat fight with FAQ (or is that FAZ?), I highly recommend Queen City Hoops swap machine thingy. I’ve switched Andrea Bargnani with just about every big man I can think of. BC should trade him for Okafor by the looks of things. Surprisingly, trading him for Kaman comes out as a bad move.

]]> By: Dave http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40258 Dave Thu, 24 Sep 2009 11:10:16 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40258 The one thing that makes me quite nervous about the Raptors going .500 or slightly over is the number of other teams who have similar hopes. There's about five teams generally agreed upon as having a shot at the #7 and #8 seed -- Phily, Miami, Toronto, Detroit, Charlotte -- and even if you beyond that, to Indy, Milwaukee and NY, you have three teams that if they're healthy (Dunleavy, Redd + Bogut, Gallinari) that are capable of winning 35+ games. That's 14 teams ... There's going to be no easy games in the East next year. There's no terrible teams that everyone can just beat up on -- like the Kings, Thunder, Wolves, Grizzlies, and Warriors in the Western Conference last year -- it's going to be a relatively even landscape in the middle of the Eastern Conference and teams are going to eat into each other's win totals. I think there's a fair chance that the Raptors finish slightly below .500 (36-40 wins). The landscape is not favourable, not at all. The one thing that makes me quite nervous about the Raptors going .500 or slightly over is the number of other teams who have similar hopes.

There’s about five teams generally agreed upon as having a shot at the #7 and #8 seed — Phily, Miami, Toronto, Detroit, Charlotte — and even if you beyond that, to Indy, Milwaukee and NY, you have three teams that if they’re healthy (Dunleavy, Redd + Bogut, Gallinari) that are capable of winning 35+ games. That’s 14 teams …

There’s going to be no easy games in the East next year. There’s no terrible teams that everyone can just beat up on — like the Kings, Thunder, Wolves, Grizzlies, and Warriors in the Western Conference last year — it’s going to be a relatively even landscape in the middle of the Eastern Conference and teams are going to eat into each other’s win totals.

I think there’s a fair chance that the Raptors finish slightly below .500 (36-40 wins). The landscape is not favourable, not at all.

]]> By: Simon http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40257 Simon Thu, 24 Sep 2009 09:52:56 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40257 1lb per week is generally regarded as the plausible ceiling for muscle gain, that is not unrealistic. What's tougher is maintaining that rate. 15lbs in a year is possible, 15lbs of muscle in one summer is definitely eye-brow raising. I'd think if protein and everything is involved, not all that weight is necessarily muscle though. 1lb per week is generally regarded as the plausible ceiling for muscle gain, that is not unrealistic.

What’s tougher is maintaining that rate. 15lbs in a year is possible, 15lbs of muscle in one summer is definitely eye-brow raising. I’d think if protein and everything is involved, not all that weight is necessarily muscle though.

]]> By: J http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40255 J Thu, 24 Sep 2009 04:08:34 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40255 If 42 wins is a miracle, then 39-41 wins would be pretty much a miracle? I guess I should tell you to expect something like a miracle then. If 42 wins is a miracle, then 39-41 wins would be pretty much a miracle?

I guess I should tell you to expect something like a miracle then.

]]> By: Raps Fan http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40250 Raps Fan Thu, 24 Sep 2009 01:43:47 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40250 Dude, not every facet of ones life needs to be whored out to make a buck. We all have jobs that pays for our lives, and we do this for fun. Somewhere to ran about our team, and start some dialog. As far as adopting a pseudonym to stir up some debate...lol, come on man! we may be idiots and do this for free, but we aren't total losers. Dude, not every facet of ones life needs to be whored out to make a buck. We all have jobs that pays for our lives, and we do this for fun. Somewhere to ran about our team, and start some dialog.

As far as adopting a pseudonym to stir up some debate…lol, come on man! we may be idiots and do this for free, but we aren’t total losers.

]]> By: FAQ http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40249 FAQ Thu, 24 Sep 2009 01:16:48 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40249 Bosh >>>> Biedrens + Jackson .... ya heard it here first .... Bosh >>>> Biedrens + Jackson …. ya heard it here first ….

]]> By: Brain Colangelo http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40248 Brain Colangelo Thu, 24 Sep 2009 01:09:40 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40248 Why the change? Why the change?

]]> By: Brain Colangelo http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40247 Brain Colangelo Thu, 24 Sep 2009 00:57:43 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40247 I think that one of the main guys who runs this site adopts new pseudonyms from time to time and then comes on the site to stir ***t up. Casa Nosta, FAQ, other guys... they all show a bit of BBall knowledge and a little bit of knowledge always turns out to be a bad thing. They come out with outlandish statements and personal attacks but they keep interest going because they're good agitators. Do I really believe that the main guys impersonsate these agitators on their own site? No. That's pretty farfetched. Who has the time? But then again, who has the time to post all this stuff without making a dime from it? I love the site but I will never understand you guys. Ever. FAQ: There are no sure things. Beyond past performance and assumptions about how Hedo will fit with his new teammates, how can we predit how he'll do? If one of Belinelli, Double De and Amir becomes an allstar then BC will have hit a home run. If two of them become good rotation players (including one an effective starter) then BC will have at least hit for extra bases. If one of them becomes a solid starter and the other two stink then the problem was Devean George, Delfino and Roko Leni in the first place. That's hitting a single. Anything less and those moves will be considered an out, maybe a double play. 41 wins is reasonable and fairly likely. 35 or less would suck. 45 or more would be a pretty successful year for this team. Honk honk (just saving you time, buddy... now you can get back to pursuing your unabomberish ways). -BC PS. Sorry for ranting. FAQ bugs me. I think that one of the main guys who runs this site adopts new pseudonyms from time to time and then comes on the site to stir ***t up. Casa Nosta, FAQ, other guys… they all show a bit of BBall knowledge and a little bit of knowledge always turns out to be a bad thing. They come out with outlandish statements and personal attacks but they keep interest going because they’re good agitators. Do I really believe that the main guys impersonsate these agitators on their own site? No. That’s pretty farfetched. Who has the time? But then again, who has the time to post all this stuff without making a dime from it? I love the site but I will never understand you guys. Ever.

FAQ: There are no sure things. Beyond past performance and assumptions about how Hedo will fit with his new teammates, how can we predit how he’ll do? If one of Belinelli, Double De and Amir becomes an allstar then BC will have hit a home run. If two of them become good rotation players (including one an effective starter) then BC will have at least hit for extra bases. If one of them becomes a solid starter and the other two stink then the problem was Devean George, Delfino and Roko Leni in the first place. That’s hitting a single. Anything less and those moves will be considered an out, maybe a double play.

41 wins is reasonable and fairly likely. 35 or less would suck. 45 or more would be a pretty successful year for this team.

Honk honk (just saving you time, buddy… now you can get back to pursuing your unabomberish ways).

-BC

PS. Sorry for ranting. FAQ bugs me.

]]> By: Alex http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40246 Alex Thu, 24 Sep 2009 00:05:06 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/09/22/liston-45-wins-wont-be-a-layup/#comment-40246 So in other news I am really excited to see this team play together. Wouldn't life be great if people that are so mad at the world cause they havnt gotten there johnson wet in 20 years didnt post on fan websites, where people are obviously gonna be bias towards the team the site is about since it is you know a FAN site. So in other news I am really excited to see this team play together. Wouldn’t life be great if people that are so mad at the world cause they havnt gotten there johnson wet in 20 years didnt post on fan websites, where people are obviously gonna be bias towards the team the site is about since it is you know a FAN site.

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