Ask for the ball like you mean it.The post-up game is a dying thing with the game becoming more and more perimeter-oriented as making the jumper becomes sexier by the day. I blame Kevin Garnett because he started this movement of 7-footers relying on their perimeter game while being applauded for it. They thought it was the great skill, a tall guy dribbling the ball and pulling back for a jumper. I remember Garnett in an interview pointing out Marcus Camby as a type of player that could revolutionize the game by bringing the ball up the court and playing like a guard. I also remember thinking to myself then, why the hell would he want to play like a guard when he’s built like a center? It was the year 1995 – it was the best of times, it was the worst of times. More than a decade later you now have to think hard before coming up with a list of good post-up players, those who you feel comfortable dumping the ball down-low knowing they’ll do something manly with it.
Everybody loves movement and one of the factors that determines how much movement there will be in an offense is the incentive to move without the ball. An offense based around a simple high-screen often results in a two-man game with three men standing around waiting for the action to happen. A double-team resulting from a post-up encourages many types of off-the-ball movement, I’ll point to two of my favorite ones. First it’s “the cutter” whose man is helping from the strong side with the double (shortest path to double) leaving him free to cut to the rim which in turns forces the defense to react by starting their rotation, usually collapsing. If the pass is made to the cutter, it inevitably leaves a perimeter player wide open as making a paint and a perimeter rotation is tough. If the defense is late to react to the cutter it ends up being a good situation for the offense as a foul, hoop or challenge is usually the result.
Secondly, there’s the weak-side help which involves the defense sending a man from the corner or wing (usually the corner) to help out, the defense is hoping that even if the ball-handler spots the open man, the pass is too risky to make. Usually at least one swing pass is needed to get the ball to the corner sniper but if you have the corner-sniper set a screen for the weak-side wing moving without the ball, he’ll have a path to the rim, which if taken, will force more reactions from the defense. The offense gains the chance of the corner-sniper who has moved to the wing being forgotten or has the option of testing out the defense’s interior rotations. Personally, I love this kind of basketball and it’s one of the reasons I loved seeing Tim Duncan, Charles Barkley, Hakeem Olajuwon do their thing. Those players opened up the game for everyone and you played with them knowing that you will get a clean look because of the attention they command. The key to these plays is attracting that post-double which the Raptors have struggled to do consistently.
As you look at the Raptors roster and try to figure out who our best post-up player is you’re compelled to start with Chris Bosh. Leaving statistics aside for a second and going purely on feel, his post-up game remains lacking. You can lodge the same complaints about his paint-game as what you would’ve three years ago. There hasn’t been much development to speak of as he’s focused his efforts almost exclusively on the face-up game and his blow-by moves. I don’t know of a statistic out there that proves this but if you have something in mind, let it be known in the comments. Let’s just look at his outside/inside percentages over the past six years.
- 2003-04: 62/38
- 2004-05: 61/39
- 2005-06: 62/38
- 2006-07: 59/41
- 2007-08: 58/42
- 2008-09: 64/36
Don’t know how much to read into these things but I’ll say the safest thing possible: He hasn’t made an effort to take his game inside and last year was the most he’s ever relied on his jumper. I recently spoke to Steve Finamore, a college head coach in Michigan and although he loves Bosh’s game he strongly pointed out that he hasn’t developed signature go-to moves in the post, something that is essential for a PF. A drop-step move or a strong jump-hook would add to the overall threat he poses to defenses. At this point we can get into the discussion of whether he needs to put on weight in order to do that and how that would negatively affect his quickness and whether its worth it. Let’s leave Bosh by saying that he’s not a post-player, at least not yet.
Let’s move on to Bargnani. Nothing much to be said here, he doesn’t have a post-up game so we’re done with him. At this stage of his career the best chance he has of attracting a double is through drive ‘n kicks. We’ve seen some teams help on him if he’s isolated at the elbow against a shorter guy but those occasions are rare. At the start of last year Sam Mitchell looked to set-up Bargnani in the left block with moderate success but for some reason those sets seemed to vanish just like Mitchell. Bargnani’s game is the one with the most intrigue, nobody knows whether he’ll be a stiff or a star, he’s shown elements of both and frankly, it’s damn confusing. Let’s just wait and see what he gives us because his game is beyond the powers of my analysis.
The final part of our “Big Three” (I really hate that term) is Hedo Turkoglu and he is probably our best post option. Although we’re all envisioning him with the ball at the top of the circle running high screen ‘n rolls, he is the one player that will have a usable size advantage over his matchup on most nights. In Orlando he wasn’t asked to post-up much because that was Dwight Howard’s job and when Howard wasn’t in, the Magic preferred to go with the lanky Rashard Lewis whose high release point made him very effective in the paint. In Toronto, where double-team threats are few and far between, we’re going to need him to attract that double from the low block.
It’s always easier to play inside-outside with the double-team happening near the baseline followed by swing sequences which find the open shooter. It’s harder to run a high screen, attract the hedger, make the pass against your body’s momentum to the screener who then has to make the decision of shoot versus swing depending on where the rotations are. Last year Bosh was this man except when Calderon made the pass to him he was covered since nobody bothered hedging Calderon safe in the knowledge that he wasn’t a drive-to-the-rim threat. If Hedo can establish himself in the post early in the game, it adds a new dimension to our team as it allows Bosh to be the beneficiary of a double-team, something he hoped he was going to be with Jermaine O’Neal. That never happened.
It’s all thinking in the clouds right now but I’d really like the Raptors to have somebody who is comfortable backing his man down, attracting a Barkley-type double team and then kicking it out rather than depending on high screens which can be neutralized by quick defenders. As we trudge along on our quest, it’s time to look at Jarrett Jack and DeMar DeRozan. Jack is a strong player who’s built like a tank but as we discovered in my podcast with IndyCornrows, he was never asked in Indiana to enter the post to take advantage of his strength. Although the potential might be there, at 6′ 3″ he’s got no chance to do anything against SGs and if he encounters a smaller PG of the Mario Chalmers, Devin Harris or Mike Bibby variety, he doesn’t have enough experience using his moves to do anything significant. Maybe it’s something we can work on in training camp because it’ll give our PG spot some variety – Calderon playing the high screen game with Jack doing a little bit of inside-outside work.
DeRozan did next to nothing in the post in college, he either doesn’t have a post game or doesn’t use it at all. Judging by his college career and the brief summer league, he’s the type you have to send East-West through screens so he can find his position and then rise for the mid-range jumper. He’s all about raw athleticism, a fast-break game, slashing and size-advantage jumpers, that’s not to say he might not develop a post game later on. I remember nobody thought Vince had a post game until he used his jumping ability to release unblockable fades from 8-10 feet range. Here’s his DX profile and a nice article about him.
Finally, I am compelled to link to the comment posted yesterday by LukeCage22 simply because of the effort and analysis put into it.
Ladies and gentleman, I’m off to Paris for a week. I’ll try tweeting some pics from there, apparently they got some tower or something and a couple museums. Might go to London too to check out the empty Arsenal stadium. Enjoy the dog days of summer.
78 Raps
in all fairness Andrea does have a little bit of a post up game. I remember him posting up smaller defenders several times last year. the game they played sacramento and he made francisco garcia his bitch comes to mind
he also made beasley his bitch
trade bosh for Scola – Battier – Hayes
Bargs – Scola – Turk – DeRozan – Jose
Hayes – Evans – Battier – Belinelli – JJ
extras: Wright, POB
if we’re going to be the Euraptors might as well go all the way
Except none of those players are European. Can we please have one discussion that doesn’t involve trading Bosh? It’s obviously not going to happen before the season, and it’s so tiresome.
okay…this may be the lack of sleep talkin, but why am I envisioning Bosh, Bargs and Turk as a triangle that just keeps rotating for posting up and kick outs to spot up jumpers??? I’m no coach but for some reason it seems like they could just keep rotating around…whoever gets the best post-up backs his man down while the other two rotate out of the way for the spot ups….wow…i almost feel like i actually know what i’m talkin about…..wait…..does anyone else see those 3 purple elephants sitting on my couch?…uh oh… maybe it’s time for sleep.
ignore this post.
Ummmm.. Didn’t we have a LEGIT post-presence in Jermaine O’Neal?
Last time I checked, all J.O. did was post-up and we weren’t too successful with that. If we’re going to have a “run & gun offense” a post-up guy will just be a liability.
In my opinion – we need a guy that can get to the hole & finish like Amare, and I think Raptors fans saw CB4 show glimpses of that post-Olympics/prior to his off-court dilemmas. And even though he’s soft, when he’s aggressive, he can get to the line and nail free throws with remarkable consistency for a big man. I think when Chris Bosh is at the top of his game (like we saw for a short period of time last season) it’s fair to qualify him as an unstoppable (albeit against KG) NBA superstar.
So let’s hope since his contract is up, we’ll see more aggression out of our franchise player.
Cheers,
BhattMaGandhi
O’Kneel only posted up once a game and the rest of the time he shot flow-killing, off balanced, turnaround fadeaways from 15 feet. He SUCKED and was the main reason why last season was a shitfest.
And also what’s this mythological “run & gun offense” that everyone keeps talking about?? Did you watch any raptor games last year?? Did you at least look up any stats? The Raptors were DEAD LAST in fastbreak points this past season!
And calling Bosh a superstar when he’s at the top of his game is simply a ridiculous statement to make if you watched him play.
did u even watch the games. J.O posted up almost every time down the floor.
He did so, but he missed them while he was 2 millimeters away.
lol, so tru
Albeit against KG? More like EXCEPT against KG! Who else was he unstoppable against? I’m drawing blanks.
Rap of the day by Arsenalist:
“Bargnani’s game is the one with the most intrigue, nobody knows whether he’ll be a stiff or a star, he’s shown elements of both and frankly, it’s damn confusing. Let’s just wait and see what he gives us because his game is beyond the powers of my analysis.”
Man I was laughing so hard at
“his game is beyond the powers of my analysis”
Don’t worry Arsenalist, I don’t think anyone can analyze Bargnani’s game, including Bargnani.
Oh man, all I am picturing right now, is the thought of Bargnani standing with a towel on his shoulders, starring at something with his mouth open, and the cricket sound playing in his mind.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/68/Andrea_Bargnani.JPG
Omg, I sound so mean. Don’t hate me guys, I love Bargnani. He is the best entertainer on the team!
It’s not about hate, it’s just pity.
It seriously is pity, what a useless post.
Haha it is soooooo funny though
If you say so.
I have to think that Bosh’s inside numbers last year were so low are due to the fact that we brought in JO to be our inside guy. If we had started the year with just Bosh and Bargs I bet that Bosh’s numbers on the inside would have been much higher. I fully expect Bosh, under Triano, to be more of an inside guy this year.
Contract year for Bosh, he’s gunna go hard for that max money!
The one thing I hate about Bosh is when I see him use a post move, simply because I think to myself WHY DON’T YOU DO THIS MORE OFTEN!?
Over the course of the season, I’ve seen him use his superior quickness and finishing ability in post-ups in much the same way Hakeen did (not that I think Bosh is Hakeem 2.0, just that he has the same style of face-up moves), with jab steps, fakes, and spin-offs to get great looks. The only problem is that he avoids the post like Jamario avoided the lane. At this point, his lack of posting up can be attributed to how he has a weak build, and that he has a good jumper that he can rely on. I’m really hoping that with a more balanced and deep team this year, Bosh will begin to specialize more down low out of neccesity, as opposed to taking it on himself to hoist those lovely jumpers we grew to love last year. We know he has the ability, but he really has to use it MUCH more often.
As for Andrea, I like that he’s been going into the post more and more often, but that shoulder fake/jump hook move gets old fast, and judging by how he seems to stumble with more complex moves (based on his play with the Italian team), I wouldn’t hold my breath on him busting out the BBQ chicken on peoples asses next year.
Most intriguing post up game: Charles Barkley
Just pure will.
Posting up in bball means you are going to have to work very hard to earn your Million$$$$$$ … compared to the guys who face the basket, dribble and jump shoot. I’ve played both, and I can tell you it’s easier facing the basket and isolating one defender. Remember vince getting the ball at the arc and moving the ball around trying to catch the lone defender wrong footed, dribble a couple of times and then pulling up for a jump shot??? … Easy money …!!!!!
Now for Triano to convince Bosh or Bargs to post up is like asking a fullback to line up against a guard on the line of scrimmage. Arse .. do you think this is almost the correct analogy???
Driving to the hoop and offensive rebounding must be the most exhausting work in the NBA. Poor offensive rebounding earns you the title of ‘useless’… and driving on the basket too much guarantees you will injure yourself and diminish your bball career earnings.
Forget rebounding off the offensive boards, just run back asap to defence. Expect only one shot on offence with this current roster, and even Evans/Rasho can’t rebound against 2-3 defensive rebounders. Hope for long rebounds off of 3-pt. shots, otherwise run run run away..!!!
This is a ‘rebuilt’ Ratpor team, and to expect great performances is only deluding yourself. Best to watch and wait … and weep if you are a t.h.fan …….
I don’t expect great performances, but to say this team is heading for shitland which would make grown men cry is a GROSS overstatement.
What is “GROSS”, is fantacizing this team will make the playoffs and possibly in the 5 – 6 slot..!!!
What is stupid is to assume an NBA team with 7 new players are going to set the league on fire and even achieve a .500 ranking.
What is moronic is to say: “I don’t expect great performances”.. and then not defining what performance is reasonable.
What say you…????
I’m sorry that you can’t read between the lines yourself. The implication was that they weren’t going to top the conference, but they certainly weren’t going to be bottom feeders like you suggest. That’s all I needed to say really.
However, since you asked, I think it’s fair to estimate they will make the playoffs anywhere from slot 6-4. A “great” performance would be replacing a declining Boston and giving the undisputed contending teams a run for their money. I think they can achieve the former at the very least – which is FAR from what you believe will happen to this team. Lay off the extremes.
I say that I remember a couple of years ago a team that had to integrate a number of new players won the Atlantic division with a 47-35 record.
i say you are massive tool and you write this shit for the sake of having an arguement. i cant wait until the post season starts and you’re biting your tongue.
what will you say then??” how over matched we are? now lets see if bosh is a real leader?etc etc yadayadayada” get a life debbie downer the raps are back and are for real!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
FAQ…SHOULD BE FAG!!!!!!!!!!!
Anyways, the Raptors had 10 (count them,Ford, Bargnani, Garbajosa, Juan Dixon, Rasho, Humphries, Slokar and P.J. Tucker) new players in the 2005/6 season. The players that were replaced (Charlie V, Bonner, Antonio Davis, Eric Williams, Alvin Williams, Loren Woods, and Hoffa) Not only the did they manage to “gel” and integrate a team with 10 new players and win 20 more games than the following year…they all managed to win the Atlantic Division, Coach of the Year and Executive of the year. So why don’t you try to get a life and perhaps some therapy while the rest of us “tribal honking” fans hope that this year’s teams which is loaded with more talent, depth and experience manages to have a successful year…as RIDICULOUS as that sounds.
You sound pretty bitter. You must have been one the people that paid money to watch a blow out game last year. LOL
This article really bothers me. Rather than celebrate the unique players that we have, we are criticizing them for what they aren’t. Bosh’s best asset is his quickness, which helps keep defenders playing off of him so he can shoot his jumper over them. If they crowd, he can take it to the hoop. He is fantastic at this type of play, and that’s indisputable.
His entire game contradicts what you’re asking him to do in the post. If you hadn’t noticed, he has an advantage on the perimeter. He has no advantage in the post. Why would you want the guy to leave the spot where he has the best chance to score to move to a place where he’s at a physical disadvantage? It’s really baffling.
If you’d rather have a low-post player than a more perimeter oriented big man, that’s fine. But don’t rag on a guy simply because he’s doing what he’s best suited to do. And he’s doing it very well.
For the record, Bosh took the 4th most FTs in the league last year, so don’t give me garbage about him living on the perimeter.
And as long as you get to the line and shoot a high fg % whats the problem?
I completely agree with you.
RAP OF THE YEAR!!!!!!!
Yes, Chris Bosh is an excellent perimeter big, but I guess the big problem is that so is Andrea. Hell, on our whole team, basically noone posts-up consistently, and you can’t go far in the playoffs with a team that lives and dies by jump shots. The importance of a big in the post cannot be understated as both a way to get high percentage shots in times of need, and also to create more effecient spacing on the floor.
I think Bosh has a solid post up game, but simply does not use it because he has a great jumper, and like you said can blow by 80% of PFs in the league. And I am absolutely fine with those skills. But to have a team where the center and power forward play the same, mostly perimeter game, is a weakness that will rear its head in the playoffs.
I agree that a post up game is something that’s lacking on the Raps. And I agree with Macy O’Baston that Bosh has an amazing skill set.
What would be great is if Bosh could develop one or two post moves which would bring his game to a whole other level and the team another dimension to their offense (same goes with Bargs). Whether it will happen or if its something Bosh is trying to work on, who knows. Ya he’s a little thin but I’ve seen thin PFs before develop a few post moves. It’s not impossible.
KG
i agree wit you, but the raps have bin underachieving forever, the criticism comes from tru fans who are always let down, and know the team history, but this year there should be more optimism.
but untill anything good happens on the court we have to deal with these idiots
Macy has a great point.
Agreed. 100% true
Have a good time in Paris, Arsenalist. Watch out for the dog poop!
Carlos Delfino is no longer a member of BC Khimki. Both parts agree a buy out of his three year contract because the team isn’t able honor that contract. Right now he’s evaluating his options and waiting for offers. He wants to come back to the NBA and there’s some interest from the Milwaukee Bucks.
Right now he’s a free agent without any restriction.
Macy O’Baston says: Aug 13, 2009 at 10:58 am
“His(Bosh) entire game contradicts what you’re asking him to do in the post. If you hadn’t noticed, he has an advantage on the perimeter. He has no advantage in the post. Why would you want the guy to leave the spot where he has the best chance to score to move to a place where he’s at a physical disadvantage? It’s really baffling.”
…………………
Good observation … now tell me why Bargnani is expected to be a post up C this coming season … otherwise trade him??
Andrea is 7′ and 265 pounds. He’s quicker than most players his size, has excellent footwork, and a good basketball IQ. This suggests he should have an aptitude for the Low Post. He also recognizes mismatches, and drives by slower players, and posts up smaller players. Causes players to foul him with his upfake, too.
It was one of the few things worth watching last year, was Andrea abuse teams in the second half.
I don’t expect Andrea to be a Post Up C, anymore than I expect Kobe Bryant to stop shooting and concentrate on just driving. If you can’t present multiple threats, a defense can load up on you. We don’t want to stop getting Andrea’s perimiter production, we want to supplement it, when appropriate, with more post production, WHEN, and only WHEN there is a mismatch.
Good points … but don’t you think that Bargs will lose his 3 point shooting touch if he is asked to post up more often?
Posting up is a brutal way to score points and it takes a big toll on the bod. What will happen if Bargs’ 3 point shooting is sacrificed for a post-up game??
Bargs has done everything the coaches have asked of him over the seasons to change his game and apply it under NBA competition .. not easy to do and subject to much trial and error failure too as we have seen.
I think BC is mulling the problem of having two PFs in Bosh and Bargs and trying to make them into effective Twin Towers …. the trouble being that both start their game 18 to 24 feet away from the basket.
Solutions?:
1. Trade Bargs and get a C in return, or,
2. Trade Bosh and get a couple of decent post up players
Trade Bargs @ $10Mil or trade Bosh @ $20Mil … hmmmmmm
Why would you expect, or even question the idea of Bargs losing his 3point shot as a result of posting up more? Those type of hypothetical, speculative questions do not help to support your position at all. If Bargs, starts developing a strong post game, and feels compelled to use that more than his perimeter shoot as he assesses that he is shooting a better percentage in the post, that is one thing. But the idea that Bargs actual shooting will suffer is absurd.
I don’t believe there is “trouble” in both players starting their games from 18-24 feet if both are also highly effective inside 18 feet. The only way there would be a problem with having Bargs and Bosh playing together as the focal points of the offense would be if their skills contradicted each other, similar to the Jermaine O’Neal/Chris Bosh experiment. If this were the case, then Colangelo may be looking to move one of them. After seeing Bosh and Bargs actually play together, you can’t honestly say that they don’t compliment each other. All they need to do is grow together, understanding where each other is moving on the court, both on offense and defense. Once that has been established at a high level, then they will be seen in that Twin Tower classification. They have a chance to develop that this year, which I believe they will.
FAQ it is easy and safe to speculate on the negative end of the scale (helps you feel better about yourself I suppose, if the Raps do flame out as they have in the past). The thing is, that this team is actually built to be a great time, not just a good team. Trusting that the players understand their expectations and that they can adapt to one another with winning as their goal is something we as fans need to recognize more often. And while your comments are always spirited, they sometimes border on pessimistic or contradictory just for the sake of it.
I would not trade either Bosh or Bargs unless one of them demanded it, or if it was clear that Bosh, lets say, was not going to come back. I don’t think that is the case at all.
When you play low post you are working very hard around the basket .. your legs tire .. you get knocked down …. and then you have to run the full length of the court. Once your legs tire, your outside shooting suffers. Everybody knows that.
Do Bosh and Bargs play well together? I don’t think so based on my recollections from last season. They are quite different PFs .. and I believe Triano seldom had them playing together as the game progressed. They may have started together, but then Bargs was usually subbed off. It will be interesting to see if Hedo will mesh with Bosh .. I can see problems.
Yes, my comments can be contradictory, but that’s part of speculating and brainstorming … allowing yourself to consider different situations. I refuse to fall in ‘luv’ with the Ratpors because that’s a childish, fun-seeking emotional need … that is satisfied only if you imagine the Ratz must and will win. t.h. fan loyalty is paramount to help make the Ratz a winning team .. what else are fans for … certainly not for analyzing the players and games in an objective manner.
The first part of this season to end of December will determine if Bosh and Bargs are truly compatible playing together and producing wins. Let’s see ….
Since when is posting up a brutal way to score? Getting as close as possible to the bucket and using a variety of power and finesse moves to put up a high % shot is a SMART way to score, not brutal. It’s no fluke that the players who have the BEST FG% in the league are big men with an inside game…
You may on the other hand have a valid point regarding having 2 big men that prefer to play outside and face up. But thats a discussion for another day…
also AB is 23 years old!!! hes a young big man thats adjusting his euro game to the nba. i personally think hes made some far strides improving his post game and hes only going to get better. AB has proven that hes willing to adjust his game to what we need and hes shown little resistance in the process. his attitude is great and his skill set is better!! stop drinking the haterade!!!
Big Al Jefferson straight-up for Il Mago, anyone?
Good trade if Jefferson can still play.
Why would we trade Bargnani? His value is as low right now as it ever will be. I always hate the idea of trading one of my players when they are playing bad, and I know that they can play better. Look at the blue jays, trading their star Rios away for nothing, just because he had down year. That is such a stupid thing to do.
If we try to trade Bargnani away, we have admitted defeat. Trading him doesn’t make any sense, since we signed him to a 5 year extension (he will 7 more years in his contract).
Having said all of this, I would trade Bargs for Jefferson, but I don’t think Minnesota would ever do such a thing. They would probably want another good piece to make the trade. But if we wait another year, and give Bargs the opportunity to finally bring his game, the trade situation would be completely reversed. Then, we might would want another piece along with Jefferson…
no way
yes way!
Jefferson is one hell of a low post threat. I hope he’s still the same Jefferson this season after his injury…
Good god if you could get Al Jefferson for Bargnani you do it in a heart beat and see what the doctors say when he takes his physical. If you think otherwise you are a homing homer wrapped in homemade home’n cheese homeburgers.
I like the trade but its just that big Al is way worse on D than Bargs. I think we should at least entertain trade offers for Bargs.
@Rapman how is Bargs value at his lowest??? IMO its at his highest in his career because he just came off a career year (the second half) and is locked up for next 5 years at a reasonable price. And if he is as good as y’all make him sound teams would be fighting over to have him.
Yup. If he passes the physical.
There’s a 5.5 million dollar difference between Jefferson’s and Bargnani’s contracts. Other bodies would need to go the Wolves direction. And please, nobody mention Banks or any of the scrubs. Minnesota would want somebody significant, as Rapman suggested.
marcus banks + bargs?
that was meant for a reply to james ballswin
barg and bel are the two best post up players on our team. bosh is a face up, blow by, or jab step, head fake and then see where you are leaning. barg has the size to get deep position, however he needs to score in the post two or three possessions in a row to start drawing double coverage in a game. every team will take their chances on him traveling or looking grossly uncoordinated in the process.
“bosh is a face up, blow by, or jab step, head fake and then see where you are leaning.”
That’s my favourite 22 seconds of every Raptors possession.
Usually he is leaning towards bouncing the ball out of bounds off his foot. But the whole sequence is worth it to have Leo remind us once again how easy it is for Chris to “outquick” people, as Devlin’ nods in agreement. Usually this segment is only topped by the Bargnani dunk that happens in the open court once every three games, after which point Leo tells us that you’ve “got to reward the big guy for running the floor.” Yes you do, Leo. Yes you do.
It’s been a couple of days since anybody’s bashed Leo Rautins. My life in now again complete. Thank you.
Its not complete until you hear how his son plays for Syracuse.
LOL. Are you the producer of the show? I heard that guy retired, so I can only imagine what kind of production we will get this year. Hey, if it at all involves Jack rapping or MCing anything.. we are all winners!!
If Bosh improves his post game it doesn’t mean he has to stop using his quickness and post up on every defender. Bosh can still use his quickness on bigger and slower players and he can post-up and smaller forwards who can match-up with him well.
6′8 to 6′10 player with the speed and quickness similar to bosh (and if that forward had good upper body strength) could stop or contain and force him into taking bad jump shots. If bosh can add a couple post moves he can abuse these player in the post and he would be mismatch hell for any team. Also improving his passing out of the double team is crucial for his developing post up game. If teams can just double him in the post with no threat of him making a good pass to a open teammate, what would be the point of him posting up??? So passing out of the double team is something I hope bosh improve this summer.
Ah the postup game and the age old debate – Bosh or Bargnani? I don’t know about you guys, but I kind of liked it when we had J.O. lumbering and labouring around in the midpost – it always made me feel all warm and Christmasy inside. You could always count on J.O. to go 4 for 11-ish down there, (earning him the nickname “The Postmaster General” in my dad’s eyes). He always delivered that 10 point night – even if it took him 13 shots from the field and 8 free throws to do it. I remember him missing two in a row from four feet out in the dying minutes of a close game last year and my dad saying after the second miss “The Postman always rings twice.” Something about watching him pound the ball down there always made me feel as if I watching a Special Olympian in his prime. I often wonder – if there wasn’t a salary cap and we let the free market decide things – how much more than 22 million a season would J.O. have been paid?
I had some trouble with the current poll.
I really think the weak link is a toss-up between Bargs and Jose. We all know what Bosh and Turkey can do. And we all know how inconsistent Bargs has been in his short career. But what people seem to forget that Jose hasn’t really proven himself yet. As a starter, he has only really had one great half-season and one (mostly) bad full season.
Who is our starting point guard? Can he keep it up for a whole season? Time will tell.
I think I decided what to do with the poll.
39% percent for Jose… Good. Good to see people haven’t forgotten last season.
There is more pressure on Jose Calderon than any other Raptor this season.
I think that boat has sailed. He had everything to prove last year, when he got the job he wanted. Of course people will hang everything on the injury as the excuse, so really this year no matter what he does it won’t matter. It will be: “Jose is who we thought he was” or “I told you Jose was an All Star”. Nothing in between or less.
Depending on what team Jose plays on, he could be very effective. I picture him running a clean organized offense and distributing the ball to the scorers when they’re in good position.
Problem was last year it seemed like we were missing those scorers.
Again, I’m sick of everyone always looking at the negatives of all our players. Let’s be positive for a second.
Jose runs a great half court offense, doesn’t turn the ball over, and has developed a killer outside shot to keep the defense honest.
I’m not really concerned about fan perception. What I’m concerned about is how he actually fares on the court. We need him to continue his efficency on O and step up his D big time. We need him to prove that he can be more than just the best backup PG in the league.
PG is the most important position in basketball. That makes Jose the most important Raptor.
Toronto fans/folks never change. It’s either blind loyalty (uhh Leafs anyone?) or the never-impressed-super-hyper-critical-grass-is-always-greener-wall-flower-I-know-better-than-you types who make concerts and clubs and the such so much fun.
This team is very talented… at scoring the ball. We don’t have a traditional half court team being lead by a half court point guard. The only starter who doesn’t want to sit on the perimetre all day is our rook who wants to play 15 feet in. Can they still win? Sure they can. NBA Basketball is evolving to a more full court, quick scoring game. Will they win? I hope so, cuz I’m paying #$%&*(!@! Rogers too much for another 33 win season. Still the no D aspect is worrying.
What we should really be complaining about is Leo Crapins (words cannot express my hatred of this man) and Matt Devlin. Dev is bland as beige and a total company man. And he’s constantly making mistakes with players names, play calls, action summaries and he has zero insight or opinion that wasn’t provided to him through the earpiece. It’s especially bad when he delves into Swirsky land and coming up with long distance town names (that he gets wrong) or hip monikers like “The Killer Bees.” Dude is such a tool he belongs in the shed. Toast with no butter. Where’s the next Marv Albert?
I’m not going to sit here and let you hate on Matt D. (who is atrocious in his own right), while you go right on giving Rod Black a free pass. I swear to god I heard that man call Damon Stoudamire “Mighty Mouse” as late as 2005. Plus, I know he puts more effort into researching the Women’s “Skate Canada” competition than he does Raptor games.
o truss, Rob B is garbage, so is that other stiff white guy CBC uses… but c’mon they’re so bad it’s not worth mentioning. The network execs who pick these guys are doing horrible jobs. They are all puck heads so no surprise there but this is a lucrative ball market and these fools need to wake up and treat the NBA presentation with a bit more thought/respect!
Honestly huh, when I watch the Raptor games, I’d rather mute than hear these 2 lame commentators. Matt D is soooooo lame, to the point I get embarrassed of what he says.
I am not lying when I say this: When Chuck was around, I would watch blow out games because of his very good commentating. Chuck was sooooo exciting and had sooooooo many great catch phrases.
Chuck we all hope you divorce your wife, and come back to T.O. Don’t worry I’ll find you a gal. We all miss you soooo much!
“Dude is such a tool he belongs in the shed” -> Well played!
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