You now the difference, the Pops-type versus the Rasho-type. Big men who rely on positioning versus those who rely on their mobility and agility. We’ve got the positional part covered with Rasho, he’s one of the best at using his God-given frame to clog the lane, push a center outside his comfort zone in the block, draw a center out to the perimeter, use his frame to clear space inside and other things only a man built like a wall can do. On the other hand you have the more mobile center, someone who relies on his athleticism to slash inside, muscle his way around the glass, uses his leaping ability before his brain, tries to hammer everything down and feels he can out-jump others instead of boxing out. Which one is of more value to us?
I think ideally you’d like to have both types of players on your roster because through the course of 48 minutes different situations and matchups arise which warrant different personnel. Rasho could be used against a bigger body like Dwight Howard, Andrew Bogut, Andrew Bynum, Zydrunas Ilgauskas and other centers that on most nights have an advantage because of their size. Rasho’s mid-range game reminds me a lot of Luc Longley who made a living at the elbow against centers who’d rather park themselves in the paint in hopes of blocking a shot instead of coming out to guard their check. He also served as the pinch-post man on the weak side of the triangle offense, which is analogous to Rasho being a secondary option to the high screen we like to use and will be doing more of with Turkoglu and Bosh. Point is that there’s a place for Rasho on this team whether it be as a one-on-one defender, an offensive option or a rebounder.
What’s missing from the frontline is raw unadulterated athleticism which Pops can bring. Reggie Evans (God bless his heart) is a ferocious player that won’t stop playing hard and will go for every rebound out there, but he’s there to be exploited in one-on-one situations. He doesn’t have the lateral quickness to keep up with quicker PFs and is slowly losing the ability to make an impact on the offensive glass which translates to giving your team more possessions. His OREB% last year was 14.1 which is below his career percentage of 14.9. Pops’ number with the Spurs last year was 29.4 and with the Raptors it was 23.4 which means that he’s more liable to fight off box-outs and get offensive rebounds, which judging by the jumpers we’re going to be taking, is very important.
As much as I like Reggie Evans, he’s not the hustle guy that’ll give you extra possessions and fire up an under-performing unit through his energy. His role is to consistently clean the defensive glass and act as an enforcer by making sure those who get to the rim pay a price. The current roster doesn’t have a JYD-type that Triano can insert in the third quarter to give the opposing team a different look or something fresh to worry about. He doesn’t have a wildcard to hang on to at the PF/C since there’s a very high likelihood of Bosh, Bargnani and Evans all seeing good minutes in the first half. I think we can only benefit from having different types of players on the team that can pose offensive and defensive mismatches and as much as Pops was inconsistent last year, we saw that he has the ability to change the dynamics of a game. At 6′ 10″ Pops becomes an interchangeable part at the PF/C whereas Evans at 6′ 8″ is undersized for the C and a worse one-on-one defender.
If history has taught us anything it’s that you always end up using your third-string bigs. We’ve reached for the likes of Jake Voskuhl, Linton Johnston, Primoz Brezec, Maceo Baston, Nathan Jawai and Patrick O’Bryant in the last couple years and you have to agree that Pops brings more to the game than any of those guys. If Colangelo does sign Pops to a one-year deal it’ll be considered his most boring transaction of the summer but it will pay dividends. You can never underestimate athleticism mixed with agility and hustle, the only missing ingredient is consistency and there’s no better than a contract year. Or you could look at it this way, right now Patrick O’Bryant is our third-string center and nobody except Patrick O’Bryant can feel good about that.
Rasho was a good signing but he only brings half of what we need, the other half is currently missing and we can’t expect Reggie Evans to provide it. There’s a reason why a wiry PF like Leon Powe is in demand, they can be inserted into any given lineup regardless of matchup and be productive. They’re athletic enough to defend their position and can be a great fifth man in the offense who the defense will care about the least and that’s where they shine – when attention is deflected elsewhere and they’re free to roam the paint and make an impact using their mobility and energy. Not since the days of JYD and Keon Clark have we had a player that fits that mold (I’m not counting Lonny Baxter) and Pops could fit right in, and cheaply too.
There are other options to fill this role, the following are unrestricted free agents: Mikki Moore, Juwan Howard, Lorenzen Wright, Johan Petro, Rob Kurz, Maceo Baston, Brian Skinner, Sean Marks, Malik Rose, Stromile Swift, Shavlik Randolph, Michael Ruffin, Calvin Booth, Cedric Simmons, Linton Johnson, and Jermareo Davidson. Other than Brian Skinner who I’ve always liked and perhaps Malik Rose, I don’t think I’d take anyone ahead of Pops on that list.
90 Raps
bang on
Well, our main problem is roster spots, and that we only got one left. At the worst case scenario it comes down to this. Choose between Joey and Pops, while it is assured that both will sign for the minimum.
Joey plays 3-4 while Pops the 4-5. I think everyone here would agree that Joey is a better player than Pops both on the offensive and the defensive end of the game. And I think again everyone would agree that we need a a guys who can play the 3-4 more than a guy who can play the 4-5 because of the Sf situation.
While money is out of the question, I ask you this Arsenalist:
Why and how could you choose Pops over Joey?
“I think everyone here would agree that Joey is a better player than Pops both on the offensive and the defensive end of the game
I dont agree at all. I dont exactly think both are stars by any means, but if I had to choose between either.. I would take Pops everytime.
Yeesh picking between Pops & Joey to me is like picking which gun to shoot yourself in the foot with.
What are the chances that BC is working on a 1-for-0 or 2-for-1 trade to free up the logjam at PG, which would leave two spots open to sign Joey AND Pops, thus shoring up the 3/4 and 4/5 spots. Maybe?
Well, my point was, in WORST CASE SCENARIO with only one roster spot open, if you had to choose between Joey and Pops, which one would you think is more vital to sign?
Don’t get me wrong, I love Pops, and I am really not a fan of Joey. But at the current situation of the team, I think it is fair to say, it is way more important to sign Joey than Pops. Because we do not have a true back up Sf, and we already have a 3rd stringer Center (POB if he means anything…)
I would love it, if you guys could do a poll between Joey and Pops!
Also, this position (12th active or lower) will not be relied upon to bring any major offense, and I believe Pops is agile, athletic and energetic enough to D up SOME sf’s for SHORT amounts of time.
paddy o’bryant doesnt mean anything
You know, I think this is really the key. I (un)fortunately did not get to watch too many games last year, so I have no idea if Pops can guard some small forwards.
If he can, I would take him over Joey.
Also, keep in mind that any SF that is too small and quick for Pops to guard might be right up Wright’s alley. And as long as at least 3-4 guys on the floor are major offensive threats, I see no reason to worry about having one guy who is offensively inept (Spurs have done it, as have the Celtics and the Cavs — not a bad bunch to be emulating).
@ RAPMAN
I have nothing against Joey, I like him as a marginal player, but he CANNOT inject a team like Pops can. Realistically, this spot on the roster will garner maybe 10 minutes a game (some games). In that limited time, Pops would impact the game much more than Joey could..
YES! I agree with you 100%. Joey never truly accepted his role as a guy that brought energy to the game. He would come in, get a few rebounds, take a few jumpshots and, if you were lucky, play some defense. Pops, on the other hand, would come in and instantly bring energy, hustle, and heart. Pops just seems to want to be a game-changing type of guy. Besides changing the game, in terms of production, he gets the crowd excited. Joey would get us on the edge of our seat, simply because nobody knew what was going to happen with him on any given night.
Great Post!
only problem is that there’s no way in hell Pops is 6′10″
Bosh towered over him and he was barely an inch taller than Marion.
I’d say he’s closer to 6′8″ or so
in my opinion, he’d be better suited as a PF/SF
still a good pick up, and a fan favourite
His height matters little. It’s his ability to rebound. Barkley and Rodman were relatively short as well.
One thing he is NOT is a SF – cannot shoot one lick and certainly cannot handle the ball in traffic.
Looks like Pops is 6′9″…but some sources (NBA.com) have him at 6′10″. No big deal anyway, the guy can rebound and play in the post.
And we really have to appreciate the fact that Arsenalist wants him back even if Pops is a Tottenham Hotspur’s fan!
Hahah ;-)
If anything, his height makes him more versatile. He’s a tweener that could play a little C in a pinch and rely on that speed and athleticism to get him by. I think Pops is the right play here. With the multitude of SG type players the raps have, they could easily move one to backup SF at a bit of a height disadvantage. I’m definitely on board with signing Pops.
Now if we could just get BC to find a way to show Banks the door and free up that other roster spot. lol.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DtYYP9nZPKc
forward to around 1:28 and tell me if you still think he’s 6′9″, 6′10″, or anything close…
I’m still confused why its important. See Barkely, Charles and Rodman, Dennis. If the guy can rebound, the guy can rebound.
Turkoglu is 6′10″ and he can handle the ball, but is NOT a great rebounder.
Skill and effort factor into the equation – height doesn’t solely define a position.
Barkley listed his height in his own book as 6′4″, and he was a ridiculously good rebounder.
“Round Mound of Rebound” indeed!
Actually Chris, I paused it when Pops is standing up straight at 1:28 (chest thumping Marion, who is 6′7″) and took a screen shot.
I then opened this up in Photoshop, and very precisely measured the difference of height between the two. Call this measure A.
Now, call the distance between Marion’s ear and the top of Marion’s head measure B. I am 5′6″, and this is 3″ for me, so let’s say B = 4″
Measure A is half measure B. So Pops is probably 6′9″.
NOTE: there is a margin of error based on the angle, but he is no shorter than 6′ 8.5″ for sure (Bosh is much closer to the camera).
I agree with you, We need an athletic big man like Pops. Reggie Evans can be are goon, come on the court and do the down dirty, but against the talented teams with them big agile front lines like the Portland Trailblazers, Lakers, Celtics, Magic, Cavs etc.. He’s going to get lefted in the dust and sweating bullets like he’s in Africa trying to catch up. I understand we have Bosh who can run, but what if he gets hurt or Andrea gets hurt im not really trying to see Patrick O’Bryant… I dont know if anyone going to match the qualifying offer to pops, but if a team does under 2 million we gotta match it. deal block like the magic did to the mavs for gortat.
And it looks like this contract situation might force Pops to pull out of the GB team for this weekends games against Turkey, Isreal and Poland :-(
We could really use our one remaining NBA player. Joel Freeland better be ready to step up.
Bring Delfino back and sign Pops. Cut PO or some other scrub if we dont have the roster spaces available right now.
I like the energy and hussle Pops brings. As a bench player who will see limited minutes I like what he can offer. Plus, don’t we need a high energy guy off the bench to grab some rebounds and throw some dunks down? We don’t have that at the moment….
PS. Thanks Arsenlist for giving us stuff to read during the offseason…
I’m pretty sure Delfino won’t be back to Toronto this season (and never).
Between Joey and Pops I’d definitely pick Pops. We all loved his attitude last season, even though he didn’t always perform at a proper level.
Changing of subject, I took a look at the match Finland-Italy yesterday: Beli had a 23 pts, Bargs 21 pts + 8 rbs, but both of them took terrible decisions at the end of the game (poor shot selection, fouled out, etc.) , throwing out of the window a + 13 lead with 5 min to go, and winning the game just because of a late miss by the finnish with 3 seconds to go. Not a nice performance during clutch time…
Where was this game on the internet because ATDHE and JUSTIN TV did not
have it.
Was that collapse in the last 5 minutes the fault of the two raptors or of
the entire team? Anyway ,Belinelli had the last basket which won the game
for Italy.
I’ve seen it on the satellite (hotbird 2).
Yes, of course it was the entire team’s fault (they even had a technical foul called), and yes, Beli had the last basket for Italy, but both of them made terrible decisions in the final minutes, something you wouldn’t expect when playing against Finland. I love the guys, but yesterday wasn’t a good day, IMO.
Anyway, Bargs got to the National Team training camp being totally out of shape (as his coach said), so I guess we can ascribe this poor performance to the summer season…or at least I hope so.
I see where you’re going with the OREB% but the problem with using stats in a vacuum is you might miss the other half of the story. I don’t have the time to run it down but I’d like to see a story where an honest rundown is made whereby you examine the source of his Offensive Rebounds (I think most of them came of his own missed shots) and his turn-over rate after grabbing the rebound.
While I enjoy Pops as a spark-plug and really appreciate his hustle down the stretch in what was a listless season (got to see most of his games up close as a season ticket holder) part of the Pops issue seems to be his positional IQ.
I’m an advocate from bringing him back (I think a season with Rasho as a mentor could do a lot for him) but, as a few others have mentioned, not to the detriment of the balance of the roster.
No doubt his stats a skewed a bit, but there is also no doubt in my mind he has a nose for rebounding. And he’d be the best rebounder per min on the Raptors without a doubt (a very low hurdle mind you).
We’re talking about a position for near end of a bench > you’re not finding a big time scorer or playmaker to place here – you want (and can only obtain) a role player that can give you a few quality minutes – e.g. create havoc on the offensive glass and perhaps swing momentum a tad. I won’t hold my breath, but IF Triano and staff can coach him to not bring the ball down to waste level post an offensive board, he’ll improve by leaps and bounds here.
Finally, on a more subtle note, Toronto is a fickle crowd and can easily turn on the team – Pops’ energy and ability to get the crowd on side may be worth more than we believe.
Also remember Pops picked up basketball relatively late in his life, I’m sure he’ll pick up a lot in practice watching Rasho and Reggie.
What’s with all the Pops love? Yeah he can rebound, but his rebounding numbers are inflated cause people would double/rotate off of him. Outside of rebounding he’s a complete liability – can’t shoot, dribble,pass or play D.
Please get over this guy!!
Completely agree. Toronto fans love guys who hustle….real basketball fans would prefer someone who could, you know, play.
15th guy on the roster, if you can get a guy who can play he’s probably higher on the depth chart, we need hustle.
Guy who hustle are exciting to watch. We have other 10 guys who can play good basketball, so what is wrong in having a guy who can hustle and entertain the crowds? Stop being so condescending. I am a serious basketball fan but i want my entertainment too.
Hey, don’t mean to be condescending at all. And I’m all for the hustle guys, JYD is one of my fav all-time Raptors.
But this article is implying the Raptors NEED a guy like Pops, and that he would make a big difference. I’m be fine with the Raptors signing him, but would expect a negligible impact.
Hey Jim, the comment was meant for AltRaps. Specially when he feels that he is a “Real” basketball fan.. I mean, we all are real fans, otherwise we wouldn’t be debating these issues at the peak of the Offseason. Lets discuss the issue on its merits… I feel we need an energy guy like Pops and i agree with Arse on that. Arse makes a compelling arguement and if you feel that is not the case then present an arguement… Convince me that Arse is wrong. Don’t talk in hyperboles…
JYD, Matt Bonner, Pops, etc…. Historically the fanbase loves somebody to play to them. That’s lovely. If I want to be entertained, I’ll sit in my seat for the halftime show. For 48 minutes I want the guys in uniform playing both ends of the floor with their mind in the game (again, on both ends, that will run plays and defend their man. A couple plays off I’m fine with, it happens. Disappearing for games at a time is not an option, even if you are in there for 10-15min a game.
If you want to believe in the pipedream that this team is 12-15games better than last years squad, so be it. They could be if everybody pulls their weight. Pops hasn’t shown he can and he has garnered little to no interest from other teams in the league for a position(s) that most teams like to have backups for.
Energy is indeed a wonderful thing if it accompanies a balanced game. That applies to player 1 through 15. Nothing I have seen shows me that Pops can do it consistently and that is a factor if guys start falling to injury.
I support Jim’s view 100%.
JYD – played a major role during the Raps golden days. People dont need to think he was an amazing player, but he was our lunch box man. Played D, rebounded, easy buckets.
Bonner – started last year for the Spurs. Best 3pt % in the league…
Pops – Ill leave this one as yet to be seen
They dont need to be allstars to play important roles on a team. Some teams most important players are not and will enver be all stars!
A major role?? He certainly had input, but to say it was a major role is scary.
In Bonner’s time here he was better than what Pops has shown thus far, agreed. Again, however, his love affair with the crowd certainly outshone his basketball talent.
Again, I’m not downplaying that aspect. Some people feed off it. But I would argue that when JYD was here the team was deeper and more talented, with better leadership and when Bonner was here Chuck Swirsky could have donned a uni and seen the floor for a bit. Both JYD & Bonner had more basketball skills than Pop currently has and that isn’t saying a whole lot.
If Pops wants to, and agrees to, be Voskuhl v3.0 and sit on the bench, and we want to pay him a mil to do so, great. I just don’t ever want to see him in a Raptors uniform on the floor during important stretches of any game.
If Pops comes back, I implore you to give him a chance. When he gets into games, watch and see how much impact he has on the game. 15 points is out of the question but see if his couple hustle plays change the momentum of the game.
I don’t want him taking a 3 with 1.6 seconds left in the game but I want him in there during the infamous chronic 3rd quarter lulls we all know too well.
If he shows otherwise I’ll eat these words. In the meantime, I’ll be sleeping well at night knowing I posted this.
Is there a guy that you know of that will accept the veteran’s minimum that can shoot, dribble, pass, play D and rebound? If so, fire his agent.
Ben Wallace > Pops
:)
except he cant shoot, dribble or pass…. 2 out of 5 aint bad…
and also wont play for the min I wager. (although I would love to see the Raps grab him)
Hence the smiley face…and Tom and I have discussed Wallace in the past.
And, for your info: Ben Wallace’s return to the Detroit Pistons became official Aug 12 after the 13-year veteran signed a one-year, $1.3 million contract.
So, yes he would.
Wallace might be rejuvenated slightly by being back with the Pistons, but he’s still totally completely on the decline.
I don’t care how cheap he is, I’d still rather have Pops. That says much more about how little I value Ben Wallace than how highly I value Pops Mensah-Bonsu
Ha ha – I agree with that – but Wallace was going to someplace comfortable or to a contender.
Agreed.
Good post. You’re totally right about versatility. That’s why everyone in the league is jealous of Orlando and Cleveland now – what matchups are they NOT prepared for at this point?
I’m quite surprised, given his rebounding numbers, that this guy is still out of a job. If we can keep him, I’d be very happy.
I think we still need another 3, though – perhaps we could dump Douby, Ukic, or Banks to create another roster spot.
Dump Douby? Both this guy and POB can be very serviceable players in the future .. Douby has that quick release 3-pointer that he can hit with consistency … let’s give this guy some burn and reward him for his efforts. Too bad for Ukic but he can make $$ in Europe … Banks deserves the WNBA.
The only place POB is serviceable is at a gas station pumping gas. I don’t think you saw summer league or else you’d know that this guy has nothing to offer us. Absolutely nothing, the only reason we haven’t released him is because he’s got a guaranteed contract. I doubt Colangelo will pick him over any of the big men listed in this post including Pops. POB = #3rdStringCenterFail
And we have a winner for Rap of the Day:
“The only place POB is serviceable is at a gas station pumping gas” (TM)
Will fit nicely into my future 140 letter tweets as well.
i think people are jealous of orlando and cleaveland because of dwight howard and lebron james…just a thought
Why does everyone bash Banks so much? Is he overpaid? Certainly! But its not like this guy has no talent whatsoever. He just doesn’t fit on this team.
Boo.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DtYYP9nZPKc
forward to around 1:28 and tell me if you still think he’s 6′9″, 6′10″, or anything close…
Centres ate him up last year, he’d be better at PF with spot duty at SF
Totally agree. You have to question this part of the article:
At 6′ 10″ Pops becomes an interchangeable part at the PF/C whereas Evans at 6′ 8″ is undersized for the C and a worse one-on-one defender.
First go to nba.com and see Pops is listed as 6′9″, and even that is a huge stretch… find a pic with him standing next to Bosh and you can see Bosh is atleast 3″ taller.
And just watch some tape from last year, there is absolutely no way in hell Pops is a better defender than Evans – one-on-one, or at PF/C. Pops can get a few blocks here and there, but looks lost way too often.
Guys, assuming both JG and PMB are available at the minimum, and that BC is actually looking to fill a front-line spot, Joey is a FAR superior choice than Pops. Let’s not forget that Joey guarded Shaq last year, AND GAVE HIM PROBLEMS. I see Joey as a tough, strong, fast player who when given a consistent role/minutes scored 22 pts. in a playoff game. Great pull-up J, a nose for the ball, frankly awesome when running the break, and if Iavaroni can create a sound defensive scheme, I believe Joey can learn it and fit in well on the second unit. Pops is a leaper with ZERO offensive ability, and playing against decent teams will not be allowed to stroll in and dunk an offensive put-back. My vote would be for Joey.
Of course we’re not going to re-sign either of them, or it would have been done by now.
Guys, Pops already said he is not joining Great Britain for their tourney as he is still trying to get a deal done with the Raps. Which means methinks that he wants more than the minimum and 1 year.
doesnt anyone remember 4 years of joey never getting better? doesnt anyone know that pops missed more dunks then anyone in the league this year? please forget about both these knuckleheads and leave it empty if we cant find anything better. Wright is 6-7 he can backup the 3 if need be
But…but….but…POPS BRINGS ENERGY AND ENTERTAINMENT!!!!!
I’ll admit that’s a tad embarrassing – his eFG5 on DUNKS is 76% (http://www.82games.com/0809/08TOR13.HTM)
I mean, you know, those rims move on you sometimes and all those camera flashes in your eyes, its tough to shoot a high percentage from zero inches.
#ImeUdokafor15thMan
case closed
ROTD
You do realize many times he’s attempted dunks in traffic, and also taken off from TOO far… which is good and bad at the same time. Trying to dunk from too far shows offensive rawness true, BUT the fact that he even attempts to dunk so frequently is a great reason to bring him back. I’d rather a missed contested dunk than a flimsy soft half-hook any day (I’ve seen way too many of those over the last few seasons)
Why pops when we can have robert archibald, lonni baxter, mamadou ndiaye, jelani mccoy, pape sow, hoffa, nate huffman /sarcasm
Who do you think should fill the last roster spot?
i think they can probably get away with either not filling it…or waiting until training camp/first couple months to see who has fallen through the cracks…if your looking for a sparkplug fromt he bench i would hope that bellinelli could do that with his shooting much like eddie house or janero pargo. But failing this i would think that if we are actually hurt by not having a marginal role 15th man type colangelo could go through euro/d-league/free agency and find someone. also the legend pops doesnt really bring a veteran presence that would be helpful as a 15th man. people mentioned ben wallace before he was signed…didnt exactly agree with that due to his history of being a main guy which isnt what he is anymore. colangelo is probably looking at someone like skinner although i think he is an overrated. people are yearning for bruce bowen but i would reference another time that the raps picked up a veteran defensive player from a talented team…michael curry…didnt exactly work out. in any case i dont think we are desperate to fill the spot especially with the need to have time for derozan bellinelli and wright while considering that turk will play 37 ish min
Pops brings excitment Vs. Pops is not a ‘real’ basketball player.
The bottom line is that the guy was a real factor in games, helping the raps finish strong last year. He contributed to WINS. We all saw the games. What’s the problem with filling the 15th spot for cheap with a guy like that. HE PLAYS BASKETBALL. HE IS A BASKETBALL PLAYER. BASKETBALL PLAYERS COME IN DIFFERENT HEIGHTS, WEIGHTS, ROLES, POSITIONS ETC.
Bring him back already!
5 of the last 10 games he played 6 minutes or less.
In the last 10 games his FG stats were:
5/8
0/2
0/0
0/7
1/3
3/11
3/6
0/0
4/10
0/4
In the 5 games he played more that 5 minutes, he pulled down double digit rebounds once.
Agreed he had a bad finger, but his minutes, offensive output and lack of boards don’t exactly help your argument that he helped the Raps finish strong last year, especially when one of those 20min games was a 30pt blowout loss to the powerhouse Indiana Pacers.
If you come back with stats don’t tell the whole story, then you have never seen Pops play off the ball.
I think we should just sign Derrick Martin to the last roster spot and be done with it!
hahaaaha
I still idolize him for keeping our 3 pointer streak alive. We should retire HIS jersey.
I fucking agree… if we didnt have that record the raps would be left with….
and with 6 seconds to go… MARTIN TAKES THE THREE POINTER
Pops is a project player. An interesting project, but a true 3rd stringer. Only if Raps management and coaches believe Pops can learn to play his position, not just be an energizer bunny, is there any reason to bring him back. And with 4 bigs who will play all of the meaningful minutes, there’s not going to be many opportunities for a player like Pops to see the floor.
What I don’t get is why Patrick O’Bryant, a notorious loafer and proven waste of roster space was secured, while a dude like Pops, who actually works his tail off, is potentially not going to be retained.
POB didn’t even try in Summer LEague for God’s sakes!!!!
im not sure if its a curiosity if someone doesnt try in summer league
Good article, but there is no way in heck Pops is 6′10″. Watch him stand next to Chris Bosh and it’s easy too see he’s 2-3 inches shorter.
My point is that he can NOT play center. He’s just not big and strong enough.
Joey on the other hand is a proper SF, which we need. And if he puts his mind to it, can even guard a Dwight Howard for small stretches of a game.
Getting a true backup small forward is my concern before signing Pops.
Joey on Dwight? Why in God’s name would you ever do that?
That’s like putting Jose on Kobe. Who would be that stupid?
Oh, wait…
Or Kapono on Paul Pierce?
raptors republic has the weirdest pics on there site, they’re funny but where the hell do you get these pics
Plain and simple, if we had 2 roster spots available, I would think both Joey and Pops should come back. If we serious front court depth, I would be more for Joey coming back, but this Raptors team, as the article says, is missing the athletic, aggressive element in their front court back ups.
I hear the arguements about Pops’ deficiencies offensively, his height and his basketball IQ, but I can’t see those things as reasons why we shouldn’t sign him as the 5th big for the minimum with the last spot. He would make the team complete. Any deficency last year that he had can easily be corrected with proper coaching, a full training camp, and a clearly defined role. All of which he would have had by the start of the season. Anyone still hating on Pops really did not watch the games that he played in, because if they did, they would not be debating this so intensely.
Pops is not the best ball player in the world, or even on the team, but he wouldn’t have to be. He’s got the type of motor that you want in an athletic big, and all he needs is some refinement. He’s already a fan favourite, already familiar with the coach and some of the players and he also WILL get better anyways. Plus, deep in the playoffs, would you rather have Joey Graham making a boneheaded turnover in the game or Pops Mensah Bonsu making a momentum changing thunder dunk of an offensive rebound that propels the team into a win. I would take Pops everyday, and when BC does, and we see how he fits with this new team, all of the haters on this board will begging the RR admins to remove their old posts for fear of shame…
As a matter for fact, i’m gonng do my own brief player breakdown of what to expect in 09-10 season (Pops included). All of these roles are and results are subject to change if any of these players are injured, however I believe that if the team remains relatively healthy, each player will perform as follows:
Chris Bosh – contract year, summer off, inspired by new team talent, and having worked to improve in the off season will have a career year, 23+points and 11-13 rebs, with 1-2 blocks. He’ll have a couple game winners, play improved solid D, and justify all the hype that has surrounds him. He will be more aggressive around the basket and will be solid-spectacular in every other facet of the game
Andrea Bargnani – had a taste of success and as such been able to see the benefits of hard work, has as solid relationship with Jay, is more confidant in his game, has a Belinelli (who will provide Bargs with something more positive than negative). Bargs will also have a career year, between 18-20points and 8-10 rebound with 2 blocks, establishing himself as a legitimate post presence while expanding his offensive repertoire making him ungaurdable. His perimeter shot will still be deadly, but he wont take as many 3s as in years past (though it still will be a weapon).
*Chemistry between Bosh and Bargs will be high and strong. They will play off each other and establish a dominance that no team can match nightly.
Jose Calderon – after an injury riddled season, with a full summer off to rehab, and the clear awareness that his perimeter and one on one defense was severely called into question, he will have an inspired career season as well, approx 15-16ppg and 10-11apg while continuing his hot shooting and solid percentages. He’ll get allstar talk but won’t make the team, but he will be healthy, be running the team efficiently and will be driving hard and shooting well. He also will be a much better perimeter defender than last year, though will still get beaten by the likes of Rose, Rondo and Paul every time
Hedo Turkoglu – coming off an NBA Finals run, tasted success and recognizes similar talents on the Raptors, will be the 4th Raptor to have a career year. He will be deadly when shooting, but be more effective off the screen and role, similarly run with Anthony Parker, but Turk, as he his bigger and better finishing around the basket, will run it more effectively and get more open looks for everyone. Then, when the games on the line, he will be the one to make the game winning plays. 18-20ppg with 6apg and 5 rebs. He will be serviceable as a team defender
Demar Derozan – rookie season, so he will be somewhat overwhelmed by the NBA; he is the X-factor, however from the get go, he will be an opportunistic 5th option that will score primarily off of backdoor cuts (for alleys or dunks, similar to what Jamario was doing), but also off of curls where he is passed the ball for a mid range jumper (3rd option off a play). He will have about 3 highlight real dunks a night minimum and become a huge fan favourite very quickly. He will have a solid first 10 games, a rough following 20 games, then solid for another 20 games, finishing really strong for the remainder of the season. 9 – 14 points with about 5 rebounds, while playing improving defense that will show significant strides by March
Jarret Jack – solid back up pg with sg potential. Thanks to Wright, Belinelli and DeRozan, Jack won’t play as much SG as originally thought (unless injury warrants it). Jack will back up Jose effectively, changing the tempo and toughening up the back court. He will single handedly win about 3 games for the Raptors and will have a great chemistry with Bosh. About 10-12 ppg with 6 apg with rugged backcourt defense.
Marco Belinelli – under Triano, with Bargs nearby, Belinelli will have a solid, consistent season. He will be the shooter that we’re expecting, but will also make some plays for himself and the other bigs on occasion. He will be a solid defender (against all but Wades, Kobes and Joe Johnsons of the league) and will be an offensive spark off the bench showing potential, starting a debate about if he should be starting or not. Will be deadly in the playoffs. About 8-10ppg with solid percentages, and 3pt shooting nod at AllStar Weekend
Antoine Wright – may start season at 2 guard, but not for long (as either Belinelli or Derozan will replace for most of the year). He will be a solid back up at both swing positions, getting decent minutes and providing a defensive toughness and grit that we haven’t seen; will give the team an edge and will have moments, along with Jack, where they are getting techs, flagrants or just frustrating the opposing gaurds with their defensive intensity. He will not be a stopper but will be an annoyer and very valuable. 6-9 ppg depending on how he is used, and injuries.
Reggie Evans – rebounder who will rebound plain and simple. We all know that. He will average about 8-9 boards a game with about 4-6 points. He will take a fair amount of charges and get us a number of 50/50 balls on rebounds and dives to the floor. His energy will spread to the rest of the frontcourt. He will have about 4 games where he gets a double-double; no others after that as he won’t get in double fig points the rest of the season. Will be invaluable during the playoff run
Rasho Nesterovic – solid back up center; we all know what Rasho brings, but he will bring it in smaller spurts than his last stint with the team (he is getting older). He will have a couple nights where he’s blocking a lot of shots, or getting a lot of boards, but for the most part, it will be his consistency on defense and his positioning on offense (setting screens for guys).
Pops Mensah-Bonsu – will be the energy guy off the bench, just picture his best periods last year, and add that to about 55 to 60 of the 82 games we have this year. He will develop a great chemistry with the other bigs and with Jack who will find him for more alleys than anyone else. He will rebound well, and will provide an different dimension than Evans on the boards. He will also show growth on offense that will make Jay feel comfortable keeping him out there for longer stretches than last year (depending on match ups). 4-8 ppg with about 4-7 rebs.
Quincy Douby – spot minutes and garbage time player who will play a significant role in approximately 9 games (barring injury to other players) due to his streaky shooting and match up problems that he may create. He will show flashes of brilliance but will be used sparingly and have a couple nights where we wish he wasn’t in the game, as he will be missing some easy shots. Overall, he will have a solid season in a very limited role
Roko Ukic – if he is still on the team by the start of the season, he will have a very small role, primarily during garbage time (barring injury to other players). Significantly less minutes than last year, but he will end up a much smarter and better point guard than he is now
Patrick O’Bryant – Garbage time player; almost no role whatsoever (barring injury to other players). He will be in the coaches doghouse frequently
Marcus Banks – Garbage time player, with almost no role as well; he will have a couple games where he does play and shows off his nice 3pt stroke, but will get lost behind a deep guard rotation. Will show more than POB, but will still get less playing time than anyone else on the team.
Haha, you speak like you are a fortune teller.
“I can see all of this in the color of the Raptors flag..”
By the way you are talking about our team, it sounds like we will be the best team in the history of the NBA.
You and FAQ are like brothers separated from birth. I would love to listen to you two debate about the Raptors.
I wish I lived on the cloud with puppydogs and sunshine like you must. I added the mean scoring average of all the players (including 0 for Rasho, Q-Pac, Ukic, POB, and Banks because they weren’t specified) and it came to 126.5. Colangelo really is a genious if his team can improve by 20PPG over the summer.
Well they wont be THAT good on offence. Remember that they all played on diffrent teams and got more looks than they will this year.
Now saying that, they deffinatly have alot of guys who can put the ball in the net and thats never a bad thing.
While they wont put 126ppg up on the board every night, they will be an entertaining offence and we can expect them to be one of the better offensive teams in the NBA.
I guess you didn’t catch my sarcasm. I know they won’t be putting up those numbers, no team ever does. But those numbers he listed weren’t based on actual stats, but on what he thinks will happen next year.
Yeah, so those point projections are estimates of course. The numbers will vary depending on who gets what opportunity within the offense, but I believe that regardless, we will have at least two 20 point scorers and another two 15+ point scorers, while having 2 other 10+ point scorers. I don’t believe they will average 126 ppg or even 115 ppg, but it will be probably between the 101 and the 106 range per game. The team’s offense will be a staple for their success, as such, these high point totals are what he should come to expect.
Aside from the specifics on the numbers, the players will have a year similar to what I’ve listed, based on everyone’s projected role.
Remember that you can’t just add up the averages for the different players – it will always add up to a higher number than the team’s total, because players WILL miss games due to injury and coaches decisions.
I think his assumption is that there won’t be any MAJOR injuries, so really, if we assume a decent 75 games each for everyone, then the team average is closer to 115 PPG.
Still terribly optimistic, but not 126 PPG optimistic.
I would have to agree 100% with this article. every team needs a JYD/Birdman player on there team and Pops can provide it. i understand with what your saying regarding Joey but i think the back court issue have been, if not fully address, addressed to the point where no more additions is need. i’m more concern of the 4 – 5 spot. and think about this…with his athletsium u are still go big with the front court and put Pops at the 3 (like Hedo). i know that’s a stretch but in the NBA, as we all know, it’s about match ups!!
PLEASE GET THE STRO SHOW IN T.O.!