Haven’t seen Bosh this pumped up in a long time.Crazy win, one which would’ve pumped me up to dangerous levels if it actually meant something in the playoff race. We played our fourth ideal game in a row and maintained a sizable lead throughout the afternoon. When the fourth quarter came our nerves tightened and the Bulls heated up to make it a game and would’ve taken their first lead very late on if Derrick Rose hadn’t blown a gimme layup. They were forced to foul and good ‘ol Anthony Parker stepped up and went a good ‘ol classic 1-2 from the line which gave us a two point edge. On the next possession Ben Gordon got the ball and we switched Chris Bosh on him yet again, Gordon drilled the jumper as the buzzer sounded to take it to OT where we barely prevailed. Looking back let’s just thank Parker for not missing both FTs because that would’ve put a real damper on the great team and individual performances.
I can’t explain the enthusiasm, hustle and unity this team is playing with. Wins against the Clippers, OKC and a depleted Milwaukee team weren’t great indicators of anything but on Sunday the opponent was far more motivated to get a win than any of their previous three. For the fourth game in a row we won the first quarter and did basically everything right. The ball movement spawned by Calderon was impeccable, I don’t know what it is with him playing against Rose but the rookie can’t get a hold of how to guard him. Rose was confused on the high screen and gave Calderon the open looks he needed to get warmed up and enough room on the other side of the screen that it served as an invitation to drive. Andrea Bargnani’s one-on-one game is blossoming these days and when you throw in Calderon’s renewed sense of looking for him in mismatches, it’s a good thing to watch and he rode it to 9 first quarter points. Poor John Salmons kept getting matched up with Bargnani who administered professional punishment in the post, moments later Salmons got matched up with Bosh who did the same on the boards. I couldn’t understand the Bulls’ rotations early on, they seemed very unplanned.
The first quarter saw a nice little battle between Ben Gordon and Anthony Parker. Salmons defending people he had no business defending took away from his offense and he only had one shot attempt in the quarter, Derrick Rose couldn’t get a handle on Calderon and our hedging and fight-throughs on the high-screen neutralized his blow-by game which meant it came down to Ben Gordon to do his thing. Gordon was making Parker run around at least two screens set by Joakim Noah and Tyrus Thomas (somebody tell Devlin it’s Tyrus, not Tyrese) on every play and was either nailing the shot or attracting help to dish off to the big man cutting to the rim. Parker didn’t go quietly either, he returned the favor with 6 first quarter points by doing the exact same. With Bargnani on early and Calderon getting the better of Rose, things looked up with a 31-20 lead.
Funnily enough, it was the least sophisticated offensive player that was keeping the Bulls in the game – Joakim Noah. He countered Bosh’s 10 first half points with 12 of his own. He showed a soft touch around the rim and had a good battle going with Pops who was bringing energy of his own, including a couple big dunks in transition. Salmons wasn’t even looking for his shot in the second quarter as Marion’s defense was doing the job. Jose displayed supreme confidence in his jumper all afternoon, there was no hesitation in his play and he felt confident launching it from any spot on the floor, he hit a couple threes which he wouldn’t even have dared attempted in January. Once again his ball distribution was all over the map, Chris Bosh 20 feet has been his only pass for most of this year but not so this homestand, let’s have a look at his assist distribution: Bargnani 7, Bosh 5, Marion and Parker with 2, Graham, Kapono and Pops with 1. Bargnani started off hot, cooled off and then warmed up again. His jumper’s looking very reliable but I still thought he fell in love with it a bit too much, especially considering Noah and Miller had no answer for him.
We carried an 11 point lead into halftime. Time Out. Elliote Friedman interviewed Bryan Colangelo during the second quarter and here are two quotes dropped by the GM. On the summer of Chris Bosh:
This summer we’ll sit down with Chris and talk about the variables that are out there. We’ll talk about free-agency obviously, we’ll want to bring it to a head, know what his plans are, what his intentions are. First and foremost talk about the possibility of an extension and if that’s not in the cards, then we’ll talk about what options there are and one of those options is to keep him here.
On Jay Triano:
Jay’s done a great job considering the difficulties we’ve faced…The job that he’s done, the message that he’s communicating, I’m sure it’s the right message and I’m sure its beign communicated in the right way.
That should tell you that Colangelo’s mentally prepared to lose Bosh and that Triano’s going to be the coach next year. Other than silly question about Bosh’s off-court problems, it was a good interview which brought up two of the more important issues heading into the summer. I’m very iffy about Triano returning, I think the effort’s been suspect on too many nights for him to get another shot and as for Bosh, I’d like to see him on the Raptors but if it’s at the cost of a max-money, current-team incentive, cap-killing deal, no thanks. Back to the action.
This game was played to the soundtrack of Leo harping on about how crappy Tyrus Thomas’ defense was. Funny part was that it was no different than the defense played by Bosh, Bargnani or any other Raptor in 90% of the games this season and yet we never heard such harsh criticism. Bargnani drains a tough contested jumper on an out-of-bounds play and Tyrese Thomas gets grief from Leo? Please, we’ve had enough of you.
The Bulls’ offense woke up at the start of the third as Gordon started handling the ball more and creating off the bounce against Parker. Salmons finally hit a couple threes and Derrick Rose started to turn on Noah’s solid screens for some scores. They’re not a playoff team for nothing and it was only a matter of time before they were going to be heard from. We needed to respond and did so: Bosh and Bargnani had 15 of the Raptors’ 17 points to start the third to keep the Bulls from coming all the way back. They had sliced the lead to 65-68 with 5:07 left when the Raptors responded with a 7-0 run sparked by a Bargnani three and Jose finding Marion on the post against Rose, a matchup that presented itself often because of the constant switching by both team but wasn’t taken advantage of nearly enough. Another 7-0 run saw the lead become as large as 14 before we settled for a 13 point edge going into the final quarter.
Bosh was instrumental in the third, the Bulls had come out with a renewed sense of energy and they had put a halt to our fastbreaking ball. Noah was sagging on Bosh and forcing him to test his jumper and Bosh delivered. A game-high 15 rebounds against the likes of Miller and Noah isn’t something to be scoffed at, we out-rebounded them 42-32 and were +11 in second-chance points. Lot of the credit there goes to Bosh who has been very aggressive on the boards this homestand. We relied on our two best players in this quarter and they delivered with 12 each. Having said that, I have to point out that whenever we gave the ball to Bosh in a set-piece the offense slowed down and the ball just didn’t move as well. You get the feeling he’s either going to take a shot or ask to get bailed out if nobody falls for his fakes; not exactly pretty offense.
This was a comfortable lead but the danger signs were there. Gordon and Rose were finding too many openings in our switch-happy defense and the Bulls as a team were shooting a healthy 50%. Even though we played some very good defense in the first half you could tell that the up-and-down nature of the game was starting to take a toll on our conditioning. The Bulls were going to make a run and the question was whether we had built up enough of a buffer to sustain us through. As it turned out, we didn’t as the Bulls put together a 42 point fourth quarter.
Gordon was THE offense for them, everything ran though him. Him being a dual-threat meant Parker and Bosh had a very tough time defending screens set for him. When he pulled back and opted for the Bosh switch he lulled him to sleep and knocked down a jumper. When the switch was late or hesitant, he drove down the lane. On one isolation play he contorted Bosh like MJ did Bird that one time. Our bench did a good job of holding their own to start the fourth with Roko and Joey giving us good minutes and when Jose drained a deep and very unexpected three, the lead ballooned to 17. That was it though because after that Rose used his quickness against Calderon to setup shots for Gordon and Thomas (who was missing all game except the fourth) while getting his. The dribble penetration was starting to become a big problem as it is in the fourth quarter for us, their backcourt combined for 60 points on 24-39 shooting. Our offense came undone for five straight possessions starting at 4:52 of the fourth during which span they went on a 9-0 run. It went something like this: Calderon turnover, Bargnani missing two jumpers, Bargnani 3-second violation and Chris Bosh stumbling and bumbling to lose the ball. This little lapse setup the events described in the first paragraph.
Triano switched Marion to Rose late in the fourth quarter but it didn’t seem to make a difference and if anything, since the Bulls weren’t even cross-guarding Rose, Marion had decent position at the mid-point area against Rose but we only milked it once. Calderon made a critical error in not passing the ball to Marion in such a situation because he couldn’t get a read on Gordon showing from the weak-side, it ended up resulting in a turnover and had we lost this game in regulation, that play would’ve been at the forefront of the discussion. Rose and Gordon’s performance in the fourth quarter was summed by this great Triano quote:
As the point guard goes at the defensive end, so does your team.
Their guards’ dominance continued in the OT with Rose and Gordon basically abusing whoever was guarding them, they scored 8 of their 10 OT points. We tried switching and even trapping the ball but it didn’t make a difference, they’re just too quick and too good. Two big plays defined OT for us, a Bargnani three which gave us the lead back with 1:47 left and a Bosh three-point play off an offensive rebound which once again erased a Chicago lead to give us a two-point edge with 8 seconds left. Derrick Rose then committed a rookie mistake by picking up the dribble in the paint amongst trees and committed the turnover. The Bulls were forced to foul and unlike Parker, Bargnani has ice in his veins. Bulls coach Vinny Del Negro pointed to the three-point play as the difference:
It really came down to that tip Bosh had. That three-point play was really a big, big play.
I’d say Derrick Rose’s missed layup and OT turnover sealed their fate more than anything.
Liners:
- This game was all about individual talent for the Bulls bringing them back in it and our great team-play pulling us through.
- You Bosh-fanboys will hate this but I have to mention it: He faded away when Kirk Hinrich was guarding him and Rose was showing help. WTF? I thought his reaction to the three-point tip-in in OT let loose some pent-up frustration of not coming through in the clutch all these years. Again, it was a hustle play and Bosh is best when he’s hustling. Give him the ball in a half-court set and he struggles, ask him to let loose on the boards and be the garbage-man and he flourishes.
- Brad Miller was swinging his elbows against Bosh in the high-post and Bosh took offense. Haven’t seen a Raptor take offense at anything for a long time.
- I’ve already alluded to it twice but Devlin calling referring to Tyrus Thomas as Tyrese Thomas was lame.
- Pops is not a flash in the pan. He’s what Humphries isn’t: a full-time garbage man that won’t try to take over the game with 15-footers. Don’t think Devlin should be calling him Big Daddy, so not creative.
- Jason Kapono hit a three with Kirk Hinrich guarding him number-to-numbers.
- Roko only played 13 minutes and in that short time managed to hoist up 8 shots while racking up 4 assists and 0 turnovers. One of his moves was a sweet turnaround against the smaller Rose.
- The Bulls shot 55% and we shot 54%. You can’t even say that no defense was played, this was one of those games where you give the offense a lot of credit for putting up the numbers. I thought the Raptors were active on defense and swift in their rotations, they just ran into two very hot guards.
- Jose’s showing us such a bounce in his step that even his harshest critic will wonder just how much impact the hamstring had on him. I say the jury’s still out, he hasn’t proven that he can handle starter minutes.
- Terrell Owens was at the game.
- Was anybody surprised when Parker missed that FT?
- Golden State has a three game “lead” over us for the 7th pick and we’re only one “up” on the Knicks for the 8th pick. Standings.
- For what its worth, we are seven games out of the playoffs with nine left to play and six teams to jump over.
Thanks for reading. @raptorsrepublic
101 Raps
Arsenalist, I think I’m hooked. Got up for a moment and actually had to check to see if this was here. Nice job as always. Agree with too much to list off, but … it’s so true – and almost funny … or maybe not – about Parker hitting one of two at the end. And once he missed the first, I didn’t have to even look to know the second was going in. Pressure was off.
About BC talking to Friedman, while we could do worse than have Triano back – I think he could turn out to be a good coach with everything aligned just right (though I agree with your ‘iffy’ feeling and why) – what Bryan said could easily be read as just being politically kind, I think. We’ll see.
Won’t beat the Matt-Leo thing to death, but … I just wish they’d chill a bit and let the game come to them. Every single moment does NOT have to be filled up with blather. Leo talks waaay too much. If we’re stuck with them as it seems (unless there is a God), they should be forced to listen to some of the better U.S. announcers and take notes. For about two years.
I can’t even believe were talking about Triano as coach after having Kevin O’Neil and Smitch. Third scrub coach in a row? Give me a f*cking break!
Question from someone at the game – on Pops’ big block-dunk sequence, wasn’t the block a foul? Sure his hand got all ball, but then he just crushed poor Salmons (I think it was) right under the hoop. I would think he would be held responsible for what the rest of his body did even if the block was clean, especially in the restricted area. Would someone with a good handle on the rules enlighten me?
Really fun game. I didn’t feel like leaving my couch as it was time to leave, I sure was glad I did.
generally speaking, if the defender gets the ball cleanly, the refs tend to look the other way if the contact is initated after the ball has been released…if the body contact happens at the same time or before, then it’s usually called.
it’s weird – in pretty much any other scenario on the floor, if contact like you mention is made, it’s a foul (you can’t, for example, shove someone to the ground, even if you’re 40 feet from the ball – yet, if you’ve just taken a shot that’s been blocked, pretty much anything goes). and what happens if the shot isn’t blocked, but the same contact is made? isn’t that a foul? the whole thing hinges on whether the defender makes the block cleanly.
I don’t think anyone in the entire city of Toronto was surprised when Parker missed the first… definitely the most predictable moment of an unpredictable game.
ben gordon is a good player. he’s not a star, he’s fairly one-dimensional, but as shown yesterday, he can get it going, especially on a team that struggles in the post offensively (since he’s going to get a high volume of touches), and against a team that doesn’t defend the perimeter, er, strongly. he has definite short-comings – but in a lineup heavy with
i like AP as a person, i think he’s a good clubhouse guy, and coming off the bench earning next to nothing, i wouldn’t mind having him back. but yesterday just magnified the disparity the raps face pretty much each & every game at that position. great game from jose, decent one from bargs, monster game from bosh, good contributions from the bench, marion played quite well…and still, a late double-digit lead is blown. granted, they pulled one out against a tough opponent, but still…as exciting as OT was, it shouldn’t have ever come to that. i’m not pointing at the missed FT by AP, just the overall body of work provided by the raps’ 2-guards vs. the bulls’ 2-guards (who aren’t superstars by any stretch).
oops…’in a lineup heavy with…’
should have ended with:
a ball-control PG, post players who can work inside-out or outside-in, and a versatile, defensive-minded 3, gordon is the type of SG a team like the raps could lean on when the offense goes cold.
Ben Gordon would look great on the Raps, I’ve been saying that for a while now. If only there was some way we could keep Marion and pick up Gordon we’d be in a good spot next year without having to make any major changes. AP could come off the bench to help out where needed (either as back-up PG if Roko ain’t cutting it or as a defensive stopper at the 2 spot). That being said, I think Roko can cut it, he’s just still too raw and might need another season under his belt. Calderon didn’t really get it going until his third season as well (once he developed a jump shot).
i agree Marc,
we gave Ben Gordon time to shoot on a number of occassions and he made us pay. He would look good as a raptor but only depending on his price tag. After yesterday, i think we need Marion more than we need Ben though.
No way Gordon would fit in this raps. Altough I’m not a Marion fan, I rather have him insted of Gordon. He requiers too many touches on offense and has a very cuestionable shot seletion, he can put 30 in one game and 3 in other taking the same amount of shots.
If you like the ball movement and the team play of the raps, you wouldn’t want a player like gordon on your team. Plus he’s not even a decent defender.
good points raul and i agree as well. it would be tough to sign gordon to a contact he’s looking for but if at the right price like say kapono’s contract he will be a good addition. His points production is really what we lack from SG position.
Raul,
Agree with your sentiments re: Ben Gordon, for a host of reasons. If the goal is to gradually move up the EC standings, with Calderon as the Point Guard and Bosh as the Center, then Gordon is not a good fit with this team as a Starting OG.
———-
What Ben Gordon is … is a poor man’s version of Vinnie “The Microwave” Johnson, as a scoring combo 1/2, coming off the bench for a High End Team, in the NBA. That said, he needs 4 solid defensive [physically tough] teammates on the floor with him.
i disagree…what we need from a shooting guard is someone who can defend the wing…and create their own shots (not just jumpers)…ben gordon isnt what we’re looking for….
if jose’s poor play was mainly due to injury, bosh is willing to let the offense come to him while showing the hustle he’s been showing lately, and bargnani can improve on rebounding/team defense/ball movement, while retaining a cheap marion…then this team would most likely be a playoff team…
now if they can add a player who can defend the wing and slash to create a shot when the clock is down (im with khandor on carney) then they might be able to make it past the first round…
if they had a great bench (aka a sixth man (the only acceptable place for ben gordon)) and a solid backup point (sorry roko…im not giving up on you….you just need way more time learning before you can prove ANYTHING) and a REAL coach (triano=great assistant) then i think this team could make it past the first round and perhaps be a real threat with proper development.
and without kapono.
Agree with you in most of your points. I like the way Marion fits in the raptors, he’s an athletic, experience small foward who can defend a lot of positions. Similar to moon but with a brain.
Re sign him could be a nice move only if he comes back for 4 millions.
Then bring back delfino and nesterovich (rasho’s commitment, mentallity and team play are excelent for the back up C)
Re-sign ap (for much less money) just for he’s lidership on and off the court and because he can still put number once in a while.
Add Messina as the head coach with triano as an assistant.
I think if Bargnani continous his development and calderon is healthy, this is a second round playoff team (maybe 4th seed, one big step behind the east’s big three and even better than the hawks and the heat).
I still don’t know what we should do with pops, humphries and graham. Plus, i like the idea of bringing another perimeter player in the free agency but i don’t know who.
Can we please bury this Carney talk, seriously. The guy is not a slasher, can’t handle the rock, has poor shot selection and court vision, is allergic to rebounding, generally low bball IQ and is a poor team defender. Moon and Graham are both better options and we hate them.
Ben Gordan is a smaller version of Jamal Crawford: bad shot selection, questionable defense but scary as shit when he gets streaky. There are few more terrifying that Jamal Crawford in a zone and Gordan gets the same way.
yeah I don’t know why everyone here is so nuts over Carney. We need a proven scorer/slasher/shooter at the 2 spot, not one whose been 8th fiddle his entire career.
Best game i’ve been to. There was a stretch when roko first enter the game it looked a bit sloppy on offense but otherwise great team effort for us. we need to sign pops because the team needs a energy guy like him who knows his role. Hump is good, but he gets trigger happy.
I watched the game on Chicago’s WGN feed.and the announcers made Devlin and even Leo look good. It was hilarious and when the Raps were on a roll – they were scratching their heads about why Toronto is not a playoff team?
And there-in lies the rub..the players seem happy (almost too happy), everybody is cheering off the bench, Bargnani is the most animated since seeing his first plate of linguini at Gratzi – is it that the pressure is off? Was time to jell was all that was needed? Is Pops the last brush-stroke of toughness that makes the entire painting work? Its amazing that Ukic can find his way to the rim with the entire defense aware that this guy can’t shoot. Was it the hammy all along?
Really confused about how next year’s team should be designed.
Great post, as always. The one thing that upset me the most about the Parker free throws… was that it looked like the inbounds play was RUN for Parker. Parker was coming off the bench at this point and had not yet shot a free throw the whole game. We had the best free throw shooter in the game at this point, and he was not even trying to get close to the inbounder.
It’s common sense plays like these that really scare me about Triano.
Spudz
http://www.altraps.com/forum
Kapono absolutely positively definitely should have been in that spot instead of AP. It was a good play and an easy catch, they just had the wrong guy catching the ball
Arsenalist, I didn’t see the interview with Colangelo so I’m not sure HOW he said what he did, but I’m not completely convinved by that quote that Triano will return as the head coach next season. Based upon my own interpretation of those words in “Colangelospeak”, I would lean towards him not bringing Triano back as the head coach. Colangelo seems to have his own “cryptic” sort of language and he doesn’t strike me as the most straightforward guy. Either way, thanks for posting those quotes…that’s good stuff.
Let me put it this way: He didn’t say anything that might indicate that Triano wouldn’t be the head coach next season. In fact, he was pretty emphatic about the way Triano was delivering the “message”.
Also “enjoyed” BC, and then Devlin, asking the fans to be patient. You know, after telling us that this will be a contender by 2010 a few years ago. And during the interview never mentioning how all of this is his mess. “Oh, well we missed JO and Jose for x amount of game after canning Sam”… yeah, well you brought JO in and you never got a real back up for Jose. STAND UP AND BE ACCOUNTABLE, YOU GOOFBALL!!! STOP DEFLECTING THE “REASONS” TO WITCHCRAFT AND BAD LUCK.
Love to know what sort of timetable we are working with now, or he has he learned his lesson?
Flux,
As you know, I share your concern over [i] the actual goals of the Raptors’ organization, [ii] the time-table at work here, and [iii] where the team stands in relation to the other outfits across the league, [A] right now and [B] going forward.
[amongst a number of other areas, as well]
IMO, one of the giant oversights most fans have a tendency to make regards item iii [A & B].
In the EC right now, each of the teams shape up like this:
TIER ONE
1 Boston [#3]
2 Cleveland [#1]
3 Orlando [#2]
TIER TWO
4-7 Atlanta [#4], Detroit [#7], Miami [#5] and Philadelphia [#6]
TIER THREE
8-15 Chicago [#8], Charlotte [#9], Indiana [#11], New Jersey [#12], New York [#13], Milwaukee [#10], Toronto [#14] and Washington [#15]
… and, I see little to distinguish between the teams in TIER THREE, as far as both A & B are cocerned.
There are no “jump-off-the-page” advantages in the Raptors’ corner at the moment. The team is tied to Bryan Colangelo and will go as far as his decisions will take them … in comparison with the decisions made by:
1 Danny Ainge
2 Danny Ferry
3 Otis Smith/Dave Twardzik
4-7 Rick Sund, Joe Dumars, Pat Riley, Ed Stefanski,
8-15 John Paxson, Rod Higgins/MJ, Larry Bird, Kiki Vandeweghe/Rod Thorn, Donnie Walsh, John Hammond, and Ernie Grunfeld
going forward from here.
Past NBA Executive of the the Year Awards mean absolutely nothing. In the dog-eat-dog world of the NBA, it’s the number of championships won that have the most meaning of all, when it comes to evaluating the success of teams [and execs] across the league.
Q1. Can the Raptors get a lot better?
A1. Yes, they can.
Q2. Will they?
A2. It will depend on the work and ability of Bryan Colangelo.
lol! Allow me to add another contribution to your “Mr. Obvious” Q/A:
Q3) Who will Bryan Colangelo select in the upcoming draft?
A3) It will depend on which players are still available.
As long winded as most of your posts are, they never really seem to amount to anything. You see, while I also contribute nothing, I do it with only 5% of your effort level.
LOL @ Brasky!
Bravo, Brasky, bravo!
Lmfao. This could be fun.
Q4. Can long winded responses stating the obvious and nothing substantial be made out to appear intellectual?
A4. No you dumb fuck.
lolerz.
Khandor,
In my assumption, there is no timetable and there are no goals by BC or the organization. I think, as mentioned before, the goals are driven by the fans. MLSE only delivers what the customer wants, while simultaneously brainwashing them into what’s acceptable and what “realistic” is. (BC speech last nite.. “Its been 15 years, be patient people..we need more time” – I guarantee you are going to hear that for the next 10 years)
It’s obvious from the comments on this post, that instant gratification is what’s important to people. Most people don’t think long term, in all areas of life, they just care about NOW. So, as long as the fans are gratified right now, MLSE has to worry about only that. And we know they are making money that way, hence there is no reason to change anything. Their business model is impeccable.
HERO/BORDERLINE ALL STAR PLAYER: check
BORDERLINE NBA PLAYERS THAT FANS CAN ID WITH/THINK CAN BE THEM
/WATCH DEVELOP AND GROW WITH: check
MULTIPLE EURO BACKGROUNDS ON TEAM FOR FANS TO ID WITH: check
CANADIAN COACH: check
PIZZA PROMOTION: check
CHEERLEADERS: check
Look at what a 4 game win streak vs “suspect” teams has done. All of a sudden, all is forgiven, we are contenders, BC is the saviour etc etc.
And I’d say that some of the teams in TIER THREE don’t belong with the Raps.
Most GMs (say Joe D) come out and spell out what their plan is, they lay it out. BC give us the Alice Fine treatment(copyright Dinosty), while clearly it is not, and 90% of people eat it up. Hypnotic that guy, isn’t he? I’m pretty sure he has no clue what he is doing, I think his plans are only short term or always altering on the fly. The rolling business plan…lol
Eventually what you are going to hear is (just like last night) is that we had the “Chris Bosh situation” to deal with (his contract/possible departure) Well guess what BC? There would be no situation if you took care of business like a “good” GM would have. I love how people are still going on about “having faith” in BC.. I mean, what solid FA or player that you can build around, would have faith in him doing what is necessary to win? And people need to stop talking about the Suns days.. those days are over, long gone and irrelevant (and a result of his dad’s help). What we can bank on, is that, middle of the pack FAs will come here to raise their stock and move on. And we have countless examples of that. The evidence, up to this point, suggests this is and always will a farm team. BC = 20 years in the L..Championship 0, Finals 0, 1st round playoff exits countless. Yet, we have faith and the fans keep coming. THAT is why he was EOY 2 times.
before the 4th quarter meltdown…was anyone else shocked at how poorly the game was being officiated…especially for the raptors? bosh couldnt get anything…it was pathetic.
im beginning to think the refs have something against BC because the suns never used to get calls (particularly steve nash).
nonetheless we pulled it out…a great game by bargnani, until the fourth when he was TERRIBLE, but he really sets the tone early, and its some of the bench guys that seem to disrupt it…jay needs to figure out a better subbing rotation because what he’s doing now doesnt translate into bargnani carrying over to the second quarter what he put into the first.
bosh was incredible…there was one rebound in the 4th where he got up 50 feet off the ground.
we all knew AP was going to miss a free throw.
and im glad im not the only one who was annoyed with TYREESE thomas.
I hate how Devlin puts an “ah” after/before every single name. He keeps calling Marion Shawn-ah Marion. Sometimes it’s even Shawn-ah Marion-ah.
I’ve noticed the Devlin thing too…oh wait, AB’s first name isn’t Andre…nevermind.
BC e-mails complaints about the officiating to head office while the game is going on. Guess he’s got a good data package for his blackberry. Maybe the refs don’t like that. Maybe he should stop for awhile.
Or maybe the refs figure the Raptors are a bunch of soft little whiners and deserve to be fouled. I’ve felt that way in the second half of the season.
Finally, yeah, now I’m confused too. This too-little-too-late streak will really have me scratching my head if they show some toughness (win or lose) against Orlando. Go Raps?
The refs made up for it with some clutch no calls down the stretch for the bulls, particularly any time d.rose got bodied on drives.
Triano can coach the Raps next season because he knows the matchups necessary in the league. Somebody like Messina would be at a distinct disadvantage not knowing NBA matchups. If BC brings in Messina, he will rely heavily on his assistance to tell him how to sub effectively.
It’s apparent that Bosh will make the final decision where he will play next season, or the year after. BC has admitted that. Sooooo, what will Bosh do .. stay? .. leave? .. try to make another baby???
Gordon is not the right man for the Raptors. He is a shooter only, another Kapono, dosen’t pass the ball, dosent dribble drive to the hoop, dosent play defense. He can score but 26 shots will not be available with the Raptors for a shooting guard.
Kapono can’t find his own shot, Gordon can.
I agree that his defence is questionable but he would fit in nicely if the Raps committed to an up-tempo run-and-gun offense.
Ben Gordon is in the same player category at Iverson and Nate Robinson.
Undersized scorers who don’t/can’t defend and are best suited to coming off the bench.
If we’re looking to add a 6th-man wing player who can come off the bench and be a scorer, then Gordon would be perfect.
But we need a starting SG who can create their own shot and play within a team/ball movement system. Unfortunately, those are not Gordon’s strenghts.
I think playing team ball is more on the coach than on individual players. If you can get Gordon to buy into it he’d be downright deadly.
Calderon’s digits where impressive…I guess they are trying to buy our loyalty back.
on a side note…i was glancing at the louisville/mich state game and i couldnt help but notice that earl clark was a giant…i can see why scouts love the guys “upside” just based on looking at his body…but i didnt see him doing anything very important…and his defense actually didnt look like much…he set good screens though and looked kinda efficient when going to the rack…
if i had to make a decision based on 10 minutes of watching him…i wouldnt mind drafting him if certain other players werent available.
I think whomever we get we will be fine. I have faith in B-Co’s drafting ability.
Someone correct me if I’m wrong but I believe he has drafted the following in his time of the suns and raps
Marion – Round 1
Stoudemire – Round 1
Barbosa – Round 1
Deng – Round 1
Robinson Round 1
Gortat – Round 2
Barney – Round 1
Other first rounders are inconsequential (imo). Assuming this list is correct…not a bad ratio of good players found.
I think you can add Steve Nash to your list. Additionally, Deng was drafted by the Bulls in 2005.
It’s unfortunate that Robert Starver forced the team to trade all of the 1st round picks BC acquired from ALT for Joe Johnson.
*All things considered:
MLSE >>> Robert Starver (FTW!) lol
I agree, I also have faith in BC, and all the players you listed were good/great drafts, but Gortat???
The rest were completely useless (more-so than Gortat). @ least some value in the 2nd round..even if minimal.
Gortat is the next Greg Ostertag! Look out NBA, here he comes!
I’ve been critical of Bosh but he played a great game…he was so active at the end of the game when he got switched to Gordon, and he managed to keep Gordon in front of him. Inspired effort on the boards too, he was a warrior out there.
the cat is out of the bag for bosh, now he play the game knowing that a domestic “judge judy type shit” dispute is considerably normal these days and his image will not be affected.
i work with dudes who are terrified of child support in both the west & south side of chicago. bosh can be too. no diff…. its not fair to bosh when you got dudes on the streets with 4 + babies with several different mothers all junkied out.
nevertheless, andrea aka il mago aka belinelli looks like stallone rules the game of basketball.
When their were doing the intro announcing names. the ACC dude said
“From Spain, your 7-foot centre.” Andrea had the wtf look lol.
If the team stays more or less as is (i.e. keeping Marion, Bosh, Calderone and Bargs) what about Von Wafer at the 2? He’s a UFA. I’ve seen enough Houston games to be impressed. He can shoot. He can drive. My guess is it would take less than the MLE to get him. Anyone have a take on him?
You have to aim higher than Von Wafer and look for star power, especially if Bosh on the outs. Wafer’s had a great year but is still a role player, we need a shot-creator at either the 2 or 3 and I don’t think Wafer’s that. Just like Marion’s offense is dependent on others I think the same is true for Wafer. I’m very interested to see what GSW’s Bosh offer will be in the summer.
“Pops is not a flash in the pan. He’s what Humphries isn’t: a full-time garbage man that won’t try to take over the game with 15-footers.” – Well said..is anyone honestly gonna miss Humphries if he’s not a Raptor for long?
NO!
And contrary to Khandors belief he should not EVER be starting on this team or ANY other NBA team…EVER!!! I don’t care who you have on your team. EVER!
“Air Humphries” was a scorer in high school and for the 1 season he spent at the University of Minnesota. After 4 seasons in the NBA, Hump still thinks he is/can be a legit scoring threat.
What Hump needs is a solid half-seasion stint in I-da-ho (pun fully intended). Just ask Pops how helpful the D-League was in developing his game.
If anything, Hump should model his game around Turiaf’sm who by the way signed a $35M contract with the GSW last summer.
Hump, U-da-hoe. Just hit the boards like you hit on broads.
True enough.
Kinda off-topic but I see a little of Humphries in Tyler Hansbrough’s NBA game. Am I way off?
Wouldn’t the UNC cheerleaders be most able to assess the similarity between Hump and Hansborough? I see a pre-draft interview possibility.
Hans is Hump with better hands (particularly around the basket) and a killer instinct…it will be interesting to see how his game translates to the NBA but I’m certain he will be better than Hump.
aren’t there restrictions on who can be sent to the D-league? i think hump’s been in the league too long…
Unfortunately, one of the problems with comment/list like this:
——————————————
I think whomever we get we will be fine. I have faith in B-Co’s drafting ability.
Someone correct me if I’m wrong but I believe he has drafted the following in his time of the suns and raps
Marion – Round 1
Stoudemire – Round 1
Barbosa – Round 1
Deng – Round 1
Robinson Round 1
Gortat – Round 2
Barney – Round 1
Other first rounders are inconsequential (imo). Assuming this list is correct…not a bad ratio of good players found. – by RBB
——————————————-
is that it inevitably leads to comments like this:
——————————————-
I agree, I also have faith in BC, and all the players you listed were good/great drafts, but Gortat??? – by Shayan
——————————————-
which are strictly Kool-Aid-based and ultimately reflect the reality that suggests Bryan Colangelo will have no more success leading the Raptors to the NBA championship than he had at the helm of the Phoenix Suns. While some Raptors will be eternal satisfied with the Raptors’ exploits should they simply manage to field a competitive team which plays “entertaining” basketball and wins a good share of its regular season games … I, for one, will not.
The conditions necessary to build a league championship team have existed in Toronto for quite some time and what I expect from the Raptors is that they pursue this goal with the type of commitment and basketball acumen it will take to get the job done properly, similar to what and how the Blue Jays took flight during the 80’s and early 90’s. Less than that is doing a disservice to this team’s fanbase, IMO, considering the resources which are at this organizations disposal..
Past NBA Executive of the the Year Awards mean absolutely nothing. In the dog-eat-dog world of the NBA, it’s the number of championships won that have the most meaning of all, when it comes to evaluating the success of teams [and execs] across the league.
Q1. Can the Raptors get a lot better?
A1. Yes, they can.
Q2. Will they?
A2. It will depend on the work and ability of Bryan Colangelo.
-Khandor-
I for one would love to see a 60-win season and a trip to the conference finals. You’re just being greedy Khan. Just like your namesake Genghis.
“The conditions necessary to build a league championship team have existed in Toronto for quite some time” – Khandor
Please tell me when these “conditions” have ever existed for this franchise? When we were making the playoffs with Vince but were one of the oldest teams in the league and failed to commit to developing young talent (McGrady was jerked around for 2 and half years and he screwed us for it) and had little in the way of valuable assets or just prior to BC’s arrival when we had one of the worst rosters in the league with little hope for success in the near future? Please elaborate.
BC’s draft track record is better than most GM’s, especially once draft position is taken into account. How you are disputing that is beyond me but it fits your MO (taking opinions of OTHER’s whom you see as the only one’s who know bball and eliminate all other criteria/opinions that may work against YOUR flawed analysis).
…and your Blue Jay reference is a joke. I had very close ties to this organization for many years and can tell you that BC’s philosophy thus far has been very similar to that of Gillicks 10 year plan (putting aside the ridiculous notion that building a baseball team and basketball are in any way similar). The BJ’s had an almost exclusive talent pipeline into the DR and built a foundation on “foreign” talent, in part, because drawing big name, or even mediocre, U.S. players would be a huge challenge in a non-U.S. emerging market. Once a core of young talent was built up in key positions and the team was competitive they were able to draw “bigger” names in trades and free agency. This is an over simplified version of events but does it sound familiar?
Brian’s kool-aid tastes allot better than Khan’s piss-and-vinegar.
Also, the Blue Jays had the highest payroll in baseball in 1992-1993 when they were able to afford good free agents thanks to a boom in revenue coming from the new Skydome. I don’t think the Raps have spent the most on salary in the league in any one year since they have been in existence (I could be wrong as I am too lazy to do the research)
Also in top 3 attendance (gate revenue) for over a decade.
The Plan Of Action which Labbatts, Paul Beeston, Pat Gillick and the Blue Jays enacted over a 15 year period in order to win their World Series Championships for Toronto was far from similar to what’s happened, thus far, with the Toronto Raptors under the direction of MLSE and Bryan Colangelo.
In just his first 3 seasons with the Raptors this is a partial list of the different personnel moves which Bryan Colangelo has made to “improve” the team’s standing in the EC from 27 wins in 2005-2006 to 28 wins, so far, this season [2008-2009].
2005-2006, 27-55/.329
Summer 2006
* trade for K-Humphries
* trade for R-Nesterovic
* retain S-Mitchell
* add M-Gherardini
* add M-Eversley
* trade for TJ-Ford
* draft A-Bargnani
* draft PJ Tucker
* sign A-Parker
* sign J-Garbajosa
* sign F-Jones
* sign D-Martin
* add D-Hopla
* sign J-Dixon
* sign L-Jackson
2006-2007, 47-35/.573
Summer 2007
* retain S-Mitchell
* replace J-Todd with M-Evans
* add M-Ujiri
* sign J-Kapono
* trade for C-Delfino
* sign M-Baston
* sign J-Moon
* add J-Lucas
* trade for P-Brezec
* sign L-Johnson
2007-2008, 41-41/.500
Summer 2008
* retain S-Mitchell
* add G-Herbert
* add M-Hughes
* trade for J-O’Neal and N-Jawai
* sign W-Solomon
* sign H-Adams
* sign R-Ukic
* replace S-Mitchell with J-Triano
* sign J-Voskuhl
* trade for S-Marion and M-Banks
* trade for P-O’Bryant
* sign P-Mensah-Bonsu
* sign Q-Douby
2008-2009, 28-45/.384
Summer 2009
Anyone who would like to explain the Plan of Action at work there, please go right ahead.
The one thing that I might argue (and as you said) is that the Bluejays build up some core young talent in their pre-1992 years which attracted free agents. I don’t see Colangelo as having done that. In fact, other than Bargnani we’re pretty dry on young talent and no free agent or veteran will look at the Raptors and say, yeah, I’d like to play for his team. I guess this will be put to the test with Marion.
The T-Mac reference caught my eye. Darrell Walker screwed him more than our playoff runs. The guy benched him his rookie year when the team sucked ass, T-Mac never forgot that. There was no reason NOT to give him 30 minutes a game on a 16 win team.
The main problem that season between McGrady and Walker went way beyond just a simply benching. Safe to say that D-Walker and young T-Mac went together about as well as oil and water.
Very true.
Our young core of players that BC was pimping were TJ, Bargs and Bosh and the focus was on their development until the TJ vs Calderon dilemna forced the JO misstep that was an obvious mistake (but he was on the track and still should be given an opportunity to right the ship again). I was really trying to get across the point that you can’t really use the 10 year uprising of a non-capped baseball team with 30 players and a farm system as a example of how BC should have constructed the Raptors…but if you are, then you can’t ignore the fact there are actually more similarities than differences.
Still can’t believe Darrel Walker was our head coach at one time (but Butch also bounced T-mac around quite a bit, as well, until injuries forced him to give Tracy consistant minutes in the second half of his last year, if I recall correctly). Question – will Triano be another sad footnote or will he be the answer?…wobbly at best right now.
Khan, brace yourself…have you read Grange’s blog entry today? The source of your anti-Barg’s crusade just changed his tune.
Sometimes … hilarity hath no bounds. Anyone who has paid attention closely … e.g. like yertu … could tell others in a blink of an eye that nothing which Michael Grange wrote in his blog entry today was of the “new” or “change of heart” variety.
Then, again, it’s also clear that not everyone does a good job of paying close attention to what’s actually written on a blog before they drop a comment of their own. LOL, : )
Imposter. The real Khandor would drink motor oil before ever using threaded comments mode.
I’m manually moving his comments in the database to the proper context. Everyone’s happy this way.
You are a great man.
I rarely post but always read and this helps a lot.
and arse…..
does that make youuuu happy?
It is very big of you Arse. You do more than anyone in cyper-space to accommodate Rap fans and I think I can speak for all that we all really appreciate the time and efforts you put in to build your brand. However, I’d rather completely ignore Khandor than have you spend your time cleaning up the mess he makes on this site.
khandor has his own personal clean-up crew now? way to inflate his ego =)
Khantors Republic anyone lol (hyperbole)
Read the comments section of the blog and tell me again that “nothing which Michael Grange wrote in his blog entry today was of the “new” or “change of heart” variety.”…but yeah, not everyone does a good job of paying close attention to what’s actually written on a blog before they drop a comment of their own.
…and thank you for confirming that Grange’s opinions/thoughts on Bargs are indeed the source of your “independant” analysis of his play.
No problem.
Nothing which Michael Grange wrote in his blog entry today was of the “new” or “change of heart” variety. What Michael Grange wrote today on his blog is in-line with what he’s written on other occasions prior to today. Michael is not someone with an anti-Bargnani axe to grind; and, the fact is, neither am I. : )
LOL, : ).
You should try emailing Michael Grange directly and asking his opinion on THAT specific comment of yours.
I have every confidence that Michael will set YOU straight. If you dare … go ahead and ask Michael to expound on which one of us [i.e. he or I] was ahead of the other in our criticisms of MLSE, Bryan Colangelo and Andrea Bargnani.
Then I will ask Michael to forward a copy of the email reply he sends you to me as well, so that I can compare what you publish here as his response to you with what he sends to me himself.
Go ahead. Make my day!
ROTFLOLWKAS, : )
So you don’t have an axe to grind with Bargnani and now you’re fighting to be the original mass critic of his play (which started the first day he played in a Raptor uniform). I actually play ball in the same Tuesday night league as Grange and the couple of times I mentioned your moniker and how much of a shmuck to are he laughs and agrees…hilarious but sad.
If that’s the case then, please, go right ahead and send Michael that email I suggested so that there’s a written record of it. I look forward to reading all about that exchange, right here on Raptors Republic.
LOL, : )
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/megalomaniac
It’s me who now has an update for you … about this “claim” you’ve made, re: Michael Grange.
Today is Tuesday, the day of your men’s league games. According to the email message I’m reading right now, there’s a certain basketball columnist who [i] plays in that league, [ii] works for the Globe and Mail newspaper, and [iii] would like to have a word with you concerning the specific claim which you’ve made in this thread.
All you need to do is speak directly with him this evening, identify yourself by name [i.e. use your real name and the moniker "Raptoronto"], and he will gladly share his perspective with you on this matter, especially, his thoughts on the use of his “good name” and the way you’ve chosen to use it in this thread.
As I’ve said to you before … please, “Go ahead. Make my day.” : )
Are you trying to suggest that the drama queen Grange has some sort of credibility?? Like YOU do?
Grange has so much credibility that the Globe sending fucking Geoff Blair to cover Raptor games??
The Globe has ZERO interest in the Raptors…
There is seriously something very wrong with Khandor…..
It’s like everything that is bad about the Raptors, and has been bad for years, is personified in this fucking moron….
KHANDOR -
I just made a change in Wordpress which will show you the “Reply” button next to each comment in regular mode. Using it will display the comment in the proper context in threaded mode while displaying it at the end in regular mode. So now you never have to leave regular mode and you can still reply to specific comments.
Arsenalist,
1. You’re the best web site host there is … bar none!
2. When it comes to effective problem-solving … I had every confidence in your ability to get the job done right.
Thankfully, that confidence has now been rewarded.
I salute you, Sir.
[As I said to Scott G. last week on my blog, "It usually doesn't take me long to figure out who the REAL Players are." : ) There's a reason I post regularly here, on RR, and the simple fact is you're it! ... along with Raps Fan, and AltRaps, of course.]
PS. Here goes the first one in this new mode of operation. Let’s hope it works. : )
An open invitation to anybody who has “faith” in the ability of Bryan Colangelo, as the President/GM for the Toronto Raptors:
When you look at the rosters of the teams in the Eastern Conference, in comparison with one another:
TIER ONE – #1, #2 & #3
1 BOSTON/Danny Ainge #3
2 CLEVELAND/Danny Ferry #1
3 ORLANDO/Otis Smith & Dave Twardzik #3
TIER TWO – #4-7 [in any order]
ATLANTA/Rick Sund [#4]
MIAMI/Pat Riley [#5]
PHILADELPHIA/Ed Stefanski [#6]
DETROIT/Joe Dumars [#7]
TIER THREE – #8-15 [in any order]
CHICAGO/John Paxson [#8]
CHARLOTTE/Rod Higgins & Michael Jordan [#9]
MILWAUKEE/John Hammond [#10]
INDIANA/Larry Bird [#11]
NEW JERSEY/Kiki Vandeweghe & Rod Thorn [#12]
NEW YORK/Donnie Walsh [#13]
TORONTO/Bryan Colangelo [#14]
WASHINGTON/Ernie Grunfeld [#15]
… Please explain the reason[s] why you think the Raptors have a better chance to finish in one of the Top 4 spots, during the next three seasons [i.e. 2009-2010, 2010-2011, or 2011-2012], than at least 11 of the other teams in this half of the NBA.
Thanks, in advance. : )
I’m going to suggest this for everybody who gets annoyed by khandor. If you know that he/she is going to annoy you with his/her antics, do not engage him/her at all. Just ignore what he/she said. You don’t know anything about his/her personal life and it could be really sucky, and then wouldn’t you feel bad about insulting him/her. Just ignore the posts and comment on what you wanna comment on.
I know, I need to try harder.
Yes, you do. : )
…and you continue to make it impossible to do so.
What “I” do has influence over “your” ability to try harder? LOL, : )
If you “need to try harder” … which is what YOU said you NEED to do … then, that’s strictly YOUR OWN concern.
ROTFLOLWKAS, : )
Statement,
Sucky?
LOL, : )
No worries, there, my friend. No worries, at all.
ROTFLOLWKAS
Excellent post, Arsenalist…I actually agreed with every single word of it….
:-)
nunya,
Do you think peppering your comments with certain words that begin with c and f lend credibility to what you write here? Or, is it that you believe what you write here has little credibility to begin with?
My use of the word cunt is specifically for people like you….I have said many times, that anyone who thinks that what they say here means anything or that anyone takes it seriously is deluded…
I do it merely to vent…I don’t expect anyone to take it seriously…..I call you a cunt and believe you are a cunt because YOU actually think what you say matters….you are pretentious,insipid, pompous, arrogant and unobservant ….
This is an internet blog…made up of a bunch of people with time to waste….it is not going to change anything…sometimes someone like Arsenalist will say something interesting or funny, he shares the passion….
You are a clown to most here but you are unaware of that….I am fully aware of what I am doing….
Dear Dead WoMan Walking,
1. If you think that the comments which you leave here are in fact meaningless, I am not going to be the one to correct you.
2. If a lunatic is fully aware of his/her lunacy and decides to commit suicide, and then does it … it doesn’t change the fact that that lunatic is now dead.
Nuff, said.