Comments on: As good as it gets without getting the win http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/01/13/as-good-as-it-gets-without-getting-the-win/ The Penultimate Toronto Raptors Blog Sun, 14 Mar 2010 08:03:44 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6 hourly 1 By: j http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/01/13/as-good-as-it-gets-without-getting-the-win/#comment-15012 j Thu, 15 Jan 2009 05:14:59 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=4182#comment-15012 exactly!!! bosh is softer than pau gasoft! exactly!!! bosh is softer than pau gasoft!

]]> By: j http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/01/13/as-good-as-it-gets-without-getting-the-win/#comment-15010 j Thu, 15 Jan 2009 05:12:51 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=4182#comment-15010 nash makes up for his defensive liability by his offense. he makes quick plays or takes an open shot, and is always on the move. calderon has not been the same. it is also mostly due to his injury. too bad. nash makes up for his defensive liability by his offense. he makes quick plays or takes an open shot, and is always on the move. calderon has not been the same. it is also mostly due to his injury. too bad.

]]> By: j http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/01/13/as-good-as-it-gets-without-getting-the-win/#comment-15004 j Thu, 15 Jan 2009 05:06:08 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=4182#comment-15004 i don't think the phoenix trade will happen since they are currently rolling. we should have done that trade when nash was really upset with his team when his boys were traded to the Cats. But this is a different scenario compared to the dallas-nj trade last year. dallas's goal was to win in the playoffs. NJ wants to rebuild, a young core in preparation for 2010. but in our case, both teams would like to achieve more in the playoffs. harris definitely has improved since he is getting the minutes he is'nt getting with dallas. plus he is surrounded by mostly veterans. now in NJ, he is among the team leaders along with VC. the jason kidd trade did not work because kidd and dirk dont have chemistry. will dirk run and run and catch lobs and throw it down for a slam dunk??? nash and kidd are similar when it comes to making big men better. nash with amare and kidd with kmart (who looked like one of the elite big men in the league back then), RJ and VC. i think nash could do the same with bosh. bosh really needs to gain back his confidence. right now, bargs has been the raps best player. with steve passing bosh open looks for easy dunks, who wouldnt feel good? plus he can help roko improve his play, maybe teach him how to shoot better. i don’t think the phoenix trade will happen since they are currently rolling. we should have done that trade when nash was really upset with his team when his boys were traded to the Cats. But this is a different scenario compared to the dallas-nj trade last year. dallas’s goal was to win in the playoffs. NJ wants to rebuild, a young core in preparation for 2010. but in our case, both teams would like to achieve more in the playoffs. harris definitely has improved since he is getting the minutes he is’nt getting with dallas. plus he is surrounded by mostly veterans. now in NJ, he is among the team leaders along with VC.

the jason kidd trade did not work because kidd and dirk dont have chemistry. will dirk run and run and catch lobs and throw it down for a slam dunk??? nash and kidd are similar when it comes to making big men better. nash with amare and kidd with kmart (who looked like one of the elite big men in the league back then), RJ and VC. i think nash could do the same with bosh. bosh really needs to gain back his confidence. right now, bargs has been the raps best player. with steve passing bosh open looks for easy dunks, who wouldnt feel good? plus he can help roko improve his play, maybe teach him how to shoot better.

]]> By: bearvon http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/01/13/as-good-as-it-gets-without-getting-the-win/#comment-14863 bearvon Wed, 14 Jan 2009 10:30:07 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=4182#comment-14863 brilllllzz brilllllzz

]]> By: BujuBosh http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/01/13/as-good-as-it-gets-without-getting-the-win/#comment-14842 BujuBosh Wed, 14 Jan 2009 02:38:04 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=4182#comment-14842 After doing the Phoenix deal, I woud make this trade... http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=498~510~615&teams=28~28~14&te=&cash= Toronto: Steven Nash Leandrinho Barbosa Matt Barnes Toronto’s Lineup: Nash/Ukic Graham/Barbosa/Soloman Marion/Barnes Bosh/Hump/Voshkul Bargs/Magloire/Jawaii Nice Lineup After doing the Phoenix deal, I woud make this trade…

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=498~510~615&teams=28~28~14&te=&cash=

Toronto:
Steven Nash
Leandrinho Barbosa
Matt Barnes

Toronto’s Lineup:
Nash/Ukic
Graham/Barbosa/Soloman
Marion/Barnes
Bosh/Hump/Voshkul
Bargs/Magloire/Jawaii

Nice Lineup

]]> By: Arsenalist http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/01/13/as-good-as-it-gets-without-getting-the-win/#comment-14841 Arsenalist Wed, 14 Jan 2009 02:25:32 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=4182#comment-14841 I agree, trading Calderon isn't going to do anything. Unless you're getting something ridiculous in return there's no point moving him. His defense sucks but there are far more glaring issues on this team than Jose, most notably wing scoring which is something that's been a problem for three years now. I do disagree that he's a "great offensive PG". He's got a long ways to go before he's called great. I agree, trading Calderon isn’t going to do anything. Unless you’re getting something ridiculous in return there’s no point moving him. His defense sucks but there are far more glaring issues on this team than Jose, most notably wing scoring which is something that’s been a problem for three years now.

I do disagree that he’s a “great offensive PG”. He’s got a long ways to go before he’s called great.

]]> By: MoneyCarlo http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/01/13/as-good-as-it-gets-without-getting-the-win/#comment-14840 MoneyCarlo Wed, 14 Jan 2009 02:20:21 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=4182#comment-14840 ok.. this is some serious frustrated negative BS again, kinda shit that will make you stop visiting this site. Trade Calderon now ? Correct me if I'm wrong, didnt the whole fanbase in canada want jose to stay just last year? I repeat again, Raptors problems are not at the PG spot, Calderon is a great offensive PG when healthy. Look at the vaste array of weak links on this team (in the long run): AP, moon, kapono, O'Neal and humphries they can all go in one package..ok maybe moon can stay as a good back-up to a new wing. Solomon is a waive waiting to happen. ok.. this is some serious frustrated negative BS again, kinda shit that will make you stop visiting this site.
Trade Calderon now ? Correct me if I’m wrong, didnt the whole fanbase in canada want jose to stay just last year?
I repeat again, Raptors problems are not at the PG spot, Calderon is a great offensive PG when healthy. Look at the vaste array of weak links on this team (in the long run): AP, moon, kapono, O’Neal and humphries they can all go in one package..ok maybe moon can stay as a good back-up to a new wing. Solomon is a waive waiting to happen.

]]> By: Shogunn http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/01/13/as-good-as-it-gets-without-getting-the-win/#comment-14837 Shogunn Wed, 14 Jan 2009 00:28:10 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=4182#comment-14837 Hate to put a damper on things but... Isn't Jose a BYC this year? Doesn't that pretty much kill the trade with phx? Hate to put a damper on things but… Isn’t Jose a BYC this year? Doesn’t that pretty much kill the trade with phx?

]]> By: correct http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/01/13/as-good-as-it-gets-without-getting-the-win/#comment-14836 correct Tue, 13 Jan 2009 23:03:17 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=4182#comment-14836 Well, this viewer is gonna say if they deal Jose, that will be a good move, finally. Well, this viewer is gonna say if they deal Jose, that will be a good move, finally.

]]> By: frodo http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/01/13/as-good-as-it-gets-without-getting-the-win/#comment-14834 frodo Tue, 13 Jan 2009 23:00:03 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=4182#comment-14834 verbatim: reading through some posts: Nice call on the Boston/Toronto overtime thing. verbatim: reading through some posts: Nice call on the Boston/Toronto overtime thing.

]]> By: BBD (Bring Back Delfino) http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/01/13/as-good-as-it-gets-without-getting-the-win/#comment-14833 BBD (Bring Back Delfino) Tue, 13 Jan 2009 22:56:24 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=4182#comment-14833 I know Statement. Every time he puts it on the floor and takes taht runner I want to punch someone. I know Statement. Every time he puts it on the floor and takes taht runner I want to punch someone.

]]> By: BBD (Bring Back Delfino) http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/01/13/as-good-as-it-gets-without-getting-the-win/#comment-14832 BBD (Bring Back Delfino) Tue, 13 Jan 2009 22:55:41 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=4182#comment-14832 JO forsure is a valuable trading chip, but more valuable near the trade deadline and into next season (the main reason he was picked up, all you BC haters). Kapono, not so sure about that in terms of his large contract over multiple seasons, although he would flourish in San Antonio, Boston, maybe NO, Cleveland, you know, some team that actually has players who attract double teams to get him open looks. JO forsure is a valuable trading chip, but more valuable near the trade deadline and into next season (the main reason he was picked up, all you BC haters).

Kapono, not so sure about that in terms of his large contract over multiple seasons, although he would flourish in San Antonio, Boston, maybe NO, Cleveland, you know, some team that actually has players who attract double teams to get him open looks.

]]> By: Statement http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/01/13/as-good-as-it-gets-without-getting-the-win/#comment-14831 Statement Tue, 13 Jan 2009 22:54:12 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=4182#comment-14831 Jason Kapono's PER is fucking 9.3. The league average is 15.0. This guy is absolutely AWFUL. Jason Kapono’s PER is fucking 9.3. The league average is 15.0. This guy is absolutely AWFUL.

]]> By: verbatim http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/01/13/as-good-as-it-gets-without-getting-the-win/#comment-14830 verbatim Tue, 13 Jan 2009 22:51:56 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=4182#comment-14830 i see your point. it makes sense, but i think that JO has to be our trade option along with Kapono...I am not sure Barbosa and Barnes are what we are looking for either. It is a valid thing to consider, but I don't think it should be dwelt on too long. I doubt it is even a real rumor. i see your point. it makes sense, but i think that JO has to be our trade option along with Kapono…I am not sure Barbosa and Barnes are what we are looking for either. It is a valid thing to consider, but I don’t think it should be dwelt on too long. I doubt it is even a real rumor.

]]> By: BBD (Bring Back Delfino) http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/01/13/as-good-as-it-gets-without-getting-the-win/#comment-14827 BBD (Bring Back Delfino) Tue, 13 Jan 2009 22:43:25 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=4182#comment-14827 Verbatim, you are right that Nash for Calderon STRAIGHT UP is a terrible trade for the Raps. But that is not the situtaion we are currrently debating. The possibility of picking up Barbosa and Barnes is very attractive and should at least be considered. You will never get something for free in sports, we have to give up something too. I'm just saying that it is at least worth thinking about. Ultimately I think you are right about Jose. I have watched him throughout his entire career with the Raps and he has done nothing but improve in every area of his game and I am confident that his D will get better. For anyone to say that his talent has piqued is just crazy. But we need help on the wings. And we have very little young talent (BTW Barnes and Barbosa still make us younger) and little draft options. Finally, I agree that waiting and not panicking is important, BUT if we wait to long Bosh may leave and then we are fucked. We may need to bring in a vetran like Nash (even to our detriment) to keep Bosh happy. It's a fine line though... Verbatim, you are right that Nash for Calderon STRAIGHT UP is a terrible trade for the Raps. But that is not the situtaion we are currrently debating. The possibility of picking up Barbosa and Barnes is very attractive and should at least be considered. You will never get something for free in sports, we have to give up something too. I’m just saying that it is at least worth thinking about.

Ultimately I think you are right about Jose. I have watched him throughout his entire career with the Raps and he has done nothing but improve in every area of his game and I am confident that his D will get better. For anyone to say that his talent has piqued is just crazy. But we need help on the wings. And we have very little young talent (BTW Barnes and Barbosa still make us younger) and little draft options.

Finally, I agree that waiting and not panicking is important, BUT if we wait to long Bosh may leave and then we are fucked. We may need to bring in a vetran like Nash (even to our detriment) to keep Bosh happy. It’s a fine line though…

]]> By: verbatim http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/01/13/as-good-as-it-gets-without-getting-the-win/#comment-14825 verbatim Tue, 13 Jan 2009 22:29:42 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=4182#comment-14825 We have JO on the books, who, come next year will start to look very valuable. He is 21 million dollars coming off the books. If the Raps don't hold onto him, someone will take him off our hands. Colangelo will make his move when he thinks it is right. He might be wrong, of course, he has made his mistakes, but doing it now out of panic is not the key. We have JO on the books, who, come next year will start to look very valuable. He is 21 million dollars coming off the books. If the Raps don’t hold onto him, someone will take him off our hands. Colangelo will make his move when he thinks it is right. He might be wrong, of course, he has made his mistakes, but doing it now out of panic is not the key.

]]> By: verbatim http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/01/13/as-good-as-it-gets-without-getting-the-win/#comment-14824 verbatim Tue, 13 Jan 2009 22:25:01 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=4182#comment-14824 So, Calderon is young, and at this early stage in his career he is bad at D - injuries or no. (Though I think it is serviceable if he is healthy). Solet's trade him...let's get an aging player with back issues who can't play D either. Ya, that makes sense to me. I would LOVE to have Nash here...but not in the role as the saviour of this team for Jose. That he is not. Let's see if we can get him in 2010 if Ukic doesn't pan out. So, Calderon is young, and at this early stage in his career he is bad at D – injuries or no. (Though I think it is serviceable if he is healthy). Solet’s trade him…let’s get an aging player with back issues who can’t play D either.

Ya, that makes sense to me. I would LOVE to have Nash here…but not in the role as the saviour of this team for Jose. That he is not. Let’s see if we can get him in 2010 if Ukic doesn’t pan out.

]]> By: BBD (Bring Back Delfino) http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/01/13/as-good-as-it-gets-without-getting-the-win/#comment-14823 BBD (Bring Back Delfino) Tue, 13 Jan 2009 22:22:56 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=4182#comment-14823 Yes Badass, but IF we traded Jose for another point guard who was neither much better or much worse than Jose (like Nash) and in that trade were able to upgrade our team at another position (like added scoring at the wing vis a vis Barbosa) then would it not have to at least be entertained as a possibility? Not that Nash would greatly imrpove the team, but he may help in Roko's development. The fact is, there are only so many quality point guards in this league, and Jose would be highly coveted by many teams. We don't have many trading chips to work with here. And now we have lost one of those chips becasue I don't see Bargs being traded now, which was not the situation a few weeks ago. Yes Badass, but IF we traded Jose for another point guard who was neither much better or much worse than Jose (like Nash) and in that trade were able to upgrade our team at another position (like added scoring at the wing vis a vis Barbosa) then would it not have to at least be entertained as a possibility? Not that Nash would greatly imrpove the team, but he may help in Roko’s development.

The fact is, there are only so many quality point guards in this league, and Jose would be highly coveted by many teams. We don’t have many trading chips to work with here. And now we have lost one of those chips becasue I don’t see Bargs being traded now, which was not the situation a few weeks ago.

]]> By: Baadassssss! http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/01/13/as-good-as-it-gets-without-getting-the-win/#comment-14822 Baadassssss! Tue, 13 Jan 2009 22:15:50 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=4182#comment-14822 Might've been me who said JC's offense isn't justifying his atrocius defense right now. But I think the what-have-you-done-for-me-lately crowd has hopped off the Bargnani bus and on to Calderon's. He's proven that he's a quality starting PG. He obviously isn't 100% and maybe hasn't been all year. I realize he cost us game 1 against the C's and I realize he's having a tough season defensively. But all the "trade Jose Calderon" scenarios are being way overstated. He is not the problem with this team going forward. Might’ve been me who said JC’s offense isn’t justifying his atrocius defense right now. But I think the what-have-you-done-for-me-lately crowd has hopped off the Bargnani bus and on to Calderon’s.

He’s proven that he’s a quality starting PG. He obviously isn’t 100% and maybe hasn’t been all year. I realize he cost us game 1 against the C’s and I realize he’s having a tough season defensively. But all the “trade Jose Calderon” scenarios are being way overstated. He is not the problem with this team going forward.

]]> By: khandor http://raptorsrepublic.com/2009/01/13/as-good-as-it-gets-without-getting-the-win/#comment-14821 khandor Tue, 13 Jan 2009 22:15:42 +0000 http://raptorsrepublic.com/?p=4182#comment-14821 Stince, It's a pleasure to read what you have to say about the Raptors, whether I agree with it or not. Stince,

It’s a pleasure to read what you have to say about the Raptors, whether I agree with it or not.

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